Free Markets, Free People

And The Polls Say …

That there was no bounce from the president’s speech and a majority of Americans still oppose the health care reform being offered by the Democrats:

Fifty-six percent (56%) of voters nationwide now oppose the health care reform proposed by President Obama and congressional Democrats. That’s the highest level of opposition yet measured and includes 44% who are Strongly Opposed.

Just 43% now favor the proposal, including 24% who Strongly Favor it.

Of course that being said, it is still not precisely clear what all the Democrats are offering. However if it is a collection of what they’ve offered in the 4 bills now circulating, they need to start over. When you have 44% “strongly opposed”, then politically it is time to start rethinking what’s going on.

In fact, what is being offered by Democrats is so bad that a plurality would rather keep what they have than have what is being offered imposed on them per a Fox News/Opinion Dynamics Poll:

More Americans would rather Congress do nothing than pass Obama’s plan: 46 percent to 37 percent of people polled say they prefer the current health care system to the one the president has proposed.

Similarly, more people oppose — 48 percent — the health care reform legislation being considered right now than favor it — 38 percent. While most Democrats — 65 percent — favor the reforms, majorities of Republicans — 79 percent — and independents (55 percent) oppose them.

That tracks very well with the Rasmussen poll cited above. Additionally, the response to this question was telling:

By more than three-to-one, Americans say if they were sick they would rather be covered by a privately-run health insurance plan (62 percent) than a government-run plan (20 percent).

It should be clear by now, even to Democrats, that the majority of Americans do not want a government run monstrosity. Although they do believe that health care needs some reforms, they obviously don’t agree those being proffered are the ones needed.

Time to drop the present mess and start over, looking at reforms which actually do introduce real choice and competition. Neither of those will be found in any choices which increase government control and intrusion. That is the message these polls are sending.



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21 Responses to And The Polls Say …

  • Hmmm… Imagine that. 44% of the country are racist shills in the pay of Big Insurance, or else totally duped by Rush Limbaugh and Fox News.

    / sarc

    That the dems persist in passing some sort of bloated health care takeover bill brings to mind C.S. Lewis:

    Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

    Not that I think that all the members of Congress are merely moral busybodies; some of them are wannabe despots, dictatorial wolves in “progressive” sheep’s clothing.

  • The polls reflect public whim in response to a hard core effort to convince the public that reform won’t work. Obama has to show leadership and recognize that his job is not to follow the whim or the polls, but push his party (with or without Republicans) to pass the best bill they can, and then deal with the politics. To fold and “start over” would be politically disastrous for the Democrats (look what happened to them the last time they did that — it hurt them in 1994). They have to ram through the best they can get, and then deal with the political consequences. Surrender will do them more harm than good. That’s political reality, regardless of what you think of the policy.

    And if they don’t, the unsustainable nature of the current system will assure an implosion in a few years and then you’ll probably end up with an emergency single payer system.

    • Previous Erb:

      I also think you’re going to be sorely disappointed when your predictions of Obama’s leadership failing are going to collapse. The speech is widely seen not only as a success, but just the opening shot in a PR the Obama team is very good at. Don’t say you haven’t been warned!

      • Come on, catch up. That was last week’s talking point for the left, that Obama was so inspiring that all of a sudden everyone would be for his healthcare bill, whatever it is.

        Now that the polls have not changed, the talking point has shifted to “just get it done no matter what the people think”. See, he’s not lying, or even changing his mind. He’s just a loyal minion of the left, parroting a talking point. Why be so hard on the poor little parrot?

    • If you’re trapped in a building on fire, you don’t throw the can labelled ‘gasoline’ at it just so because you can’t think of a better option.

      And in this case, its actually more like they refuse to consider any other options. But hey, lets pretend nothing else has been suggested.

    • Obama has to show leadership and actually work to make a bill from his plan.
      So far he has shown from his time in Springfield, to the US Senate, that if the legislation isn’t handed to him, there is no legislation. The trend continues into his time as POTUS.
      Campaigning for a plan that isn’t a bill is worthless, but it seems that all he wants to do.

    • Erb says, “Obama has to show leadership and recognize that his job is not to follow the whim or the polls, but push his party (with or without Republicans) to pass the best bill they can, and then deal with the politics.”

      Now, imagine if Erb had the same thing to say about, for instance, George W. Bush, who didn’t follow the polls but pushed his party to do what was best for the country in 2005, when he called for Social Security reform, and he was booed by the Demmies at the State of the Union address. Where was Erb, standing tall for the President “to pass the best bill they can, and then deal with the politics”?

      My guess? Erb really wants The Clown™ to push his malarkey through the Congress no matter what the American people want – and, clearly, they do not want The Clown’s™ boondoggle, or the horsecrappola that his fellow Demmies wish to enact – even if it means blowing the Senate up via the use of “reconciliation.”

      I, for one, want The Clown™ to try to push this thing through without any Republican votes. Not only will his poll numbers continue to drop amongst Independents, the people who elected him, but it will make Republicans more angry and more willing to march to the polls in six weeks to elect two Governors in NJ and VA, but also in 2010 to throw Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid out of work. In 2012, The Clown™ will come to realize what happens when you push garbage through the Congress that the American people by huge majorities do not want…just ask Speaker Tom Foley what happened when he pushed the 1994 Crime Bill through the Congress.

      • I take it from your praise of President Bush that you think a President should do what he thinks right for the country, regardless of what the polls say.

        On that, we agree. Politically, Obama has to ram it through, even if it’s only a one vote majority in the House and reconciliation in the Senate. Otherwise, he’s damaged himself immensely. If you’re right, the Democrats and Obama will be punished. If I’m right, other issues will dominate and people will make their peace with, and even come to like a new health care system.

        We’re the only industrialized rich state that doesn’t have one. Conservatives like their systems in other countries. We pay a massively higher proportion of GDP, with lower health outcomes than other states. That set of truths needs to be pushed hard. But Obama needs to ram it through, political consequences be damned. It’s a test. If he backs down, then I’ll have to agree that you may have a point that he’s not being a leader.

        • Erb says, “ On that, we agree. Politically, Obama has to ram it through, even if it’s only a one vote majority in the House and reconciliation in the Senate.”

          What you don’t realize, Sir, is that if Harry Reid dares to push reconciliation in the Senate, the Republicans pledge to stop all business in that body from here on out. Watch US Senate coverage on C-SPAN, and you will notice that each day starts with a unanimous consent agreement, in which both sides agree not to block any legislation from coming to the floor. Already, John Thune of South Dakota has said that if the Demmies push it, he will object to each piece of legislation, and then each one will have to have a vote to bring it to a vote, and the Republicans have also pledged 40 votes to filibuster all Demmie legislation. Because the Democrats have only 58 votes (without Ted Kennedy and Robert Byrd), they cannot shut down filibusters. Also, Thune and others have said they will put blocks on all Obama appointees, even for the US Supreme Court, which all require a unanimous consent decree to bring them to the floor for a vote.

          Erb, as I have said, there is a reason why Harry Reid and all of the talking heads on television keep saying they will push this through the US Senate no matter what, but one has to keep asking why they haven’t done it yet. I just illustrated why – pushing that nuclear button will put an end to the business of the US Senate until the next Congress convenes in January 2011.

          Don’t believe me? Look into it, and watch what happens on the US Senate floor each day. And then don’t say I haven’t told you what will happen if the Demmies cross that invisible line in the desert that they have been warned not to cross.

          • Well that’s good news. Remember what happened when the GOP “shutdown” the government back in 1995. I gave Bill Clinton an easy path to re-election! The GOP will over-reach. Happy days!

        • You know Erb, we might be the only leading power without socialized medicine, but have you taken a look at the ones who have it? They are trying to back out of it as fast as they can, but it is hard to undo.

          Germany, France, and Italy have all introduced market oriented reforms of their systems. The costs are staggering. France is nearly bankrupt because of their healthcare system.

          The British system is a farce, the waiting lines are incredible despite the government offering all sorts of freebies to Indian and Pakistani doctors to immigrate.

          Your slavish devotion to socialism is so twentieth century, time to learn a little and grow up.

          • Even conservatives support the health care systems in those countries. They are making reforms, but not undoing their systems. It works, costs are far below ours, their health care results are superior to ours. They are not trying to back out of those systems, that’s patently false.

    • And if they don’t, the unsustainable nature of the current system will assure an implosion in a few years and then you’ll probably end up with an emergency single payer system.

      While I agree with your assessment that the Democrats, at this point, are likely to be screwed no matter what they do (which I feel is totally their own fault, given their majorities in congress), I disagree that we would probably end up with a single-payer system when the current system collapses. Because a single-payer system will be government run. And both Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security are going to collapse far sooner than the private insurance industry will, and with greater economic impact.

      Therefore, when the economy gets run off of a cliff, it will be due to the failure of government-run programs. The chances that the public will be more willing to accept another government-run program in light of their tragic failure seems remote, at best.

      • If nothing is done in health care, and things get as bad as I suspect they will, you’ll probably see a single payer system by 2020. If health care is passed and it does poorly, it’ll be like Iraq was for Bush. Iraq is the reason Bush is seen as a failed President and why you have Obama with a huge Democratic majority. If health care passes and fails, then the Democrats will pay a similar press and in eight years you’ll be back to a GOP majority.

    • “Surrender will do them more harm than good.”
      Yes, it probably will do more harm than good to the party surrendering. So if national leaders should care more about their party’s power than the good of the country, he absolutely can’t surrender. However, his job now is to take care of the country, not himself.

  • The wind blows and Erb bends to the force. What did he state with such forcefullness last week? Who cares. All that matters is his slavish obedience to his Messiah. Truth be damned. Logic be damned. Lie, Cheat, and Steal – whatever to get The Annointed One (TAO) across the finish line. And it doesn’t even matter what you get when you cross the finish line so long as TAO is pleased.

    Erb, do you have any mirrors in your house? Prey tell us what you see when you gather enough intestinal fortitude to glance at the image contained within? Or do you not have the guts to look at any of those mirrors?

    • SShiell, your post is bizarre. Have you been drinking this early in the day?

      • More ad hominem from the man who claims he never engages in such attacks.

        Do you ever get tired of looking so foolish, Erb?

        • Wow, you complain that this is an ad hominem attack? LOL! You really need a sense of humor, Steverino. (And given what you guys write, it does take gall to complain that I’m engaged in ad hominems!)

          • Yes, Erb, questioning whether someone has been drinking is an ad hominem attack. The fact that you keep insisting that you never engage in such things is just one of the signs of your dishonesty.

            Listen carefully…that sound you hear is my laughter at your buffoonery.

  • Fragment of a script from what’s destined to be the new fall season’s breakaway hit, Erbonomics.

    Just you watch, dense righties! Obama will awe the nation with the purity and righteousness of his rhetoric! All will see the light and you stupid free-market deadenders will be swept aside by Obamacare’s inevitable march to vict —


    Just you watch, dense righties! Duping the nation with your mendacious rhetoric will avail you nothing! The pure and righteous Obama will not be deterred from the purity and righteousness of his purpose! And even if he is, just you wait, you’ll be sowwy … I mean sorry!