Free Markets, Free People


This Is Definitely Not The Thing To Do

I‘m a big booster of the military (yeah, yeah, I know, big surprise) but when it or members of the military do dumb, stupid or illegal things, I call them out.  This is one of those times:

A U.S. soldier on active duty in Iraq has called President Obama an “impostor” in a statement in which he affirmed plans to join as plaintiff in a challenge to Obama’s eligibility to be commander in chief.

The statement was publicized by California attorney Orly Taitz who, along with her DefendOurFreedom.us Foundation, is working on a series of legal cases seeking to uncover Obama’s birth records and other documents that would reveal whether he meets the requirements of the U.S. Constitution.

“As an active-duty officer in the United States Army, I have grave concerns about the constitutional eligibility of Barack Hussein Obama to hold the office of president of the United States,” wrote Scott Easterling in a “to-whom-it-may-concern” letter.

As Neptunus Lex says, “this is a guy way out of his swim lane”.  Lex mirrors my reaction exactly:

I’m no particular fan of the president’s agenda, but this smells too like the actions of those refuseniks who insisted that the 2000 presidential election was invalid because the result failed to conform to their preferences. Only this is worse, because the individual in question is an active duty officer serving in a combat zone. It’s going to create a huge headache for both his soldiers and their chain of command, all of whom have much better things to do with their lives – like preserve them – than to coddle the whimsies of a rogue 2LT.

He swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. This is mere vanity.

And it is utter stupidity. I don’t support this LT any more than I supported the LT who refused to deploy because he had decided that the Iraq war was “illegal”. They need to get this guy out of Iraq where his divided attention might end up getting someone killed. Then they should help him quickly learn to reassimilate into civilian life again (where he will surely become the darling of a few far-right fringe groups).

~McQ

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58 Responses to This Is Definitely Not The Thing To Do

  • I would suggest this jackass spend some time enjoying free room and board in a lil town in KS…

  • If a member of the Armed Forces believes they are receiving an illegal order the only option is to refuse such an order and suffer the poteential consequences.

    To obey an  order, if such an order is found to be illegal, is no defense.
    To disobey an  order, if such an order is found to be legal, is no defense.

    I don’t get the outrage?  Let the system handle this; it’ll figure it all out.

    • A) His immediate superior isn’t the President of the US.
      B) He’s received no “illegal orders” from his superiors (who, btw, aren’t the President).
      C) His job is to lead his soldiers, not be distracted by and act on fringe politics. Soldiers are supposed to be apolitical.
      D) If he belonged to me he’d have gotten a “straighten up and fly right” Dutch uncle talk followed by an administrative discharge if he didn’t.

      • When you say soldiers are supposed to be apolitical, do you mean that they are legally restricted from publicly expressing a political opinion?  Or is “supposed to be apolitical” an unwritten rule?
        Has any credible person or organization conclusively proved Obama’s birth in the US?  It’s important, because if it is proved that he isn’t a natural born citizen, then his Presidency is un-Constitututional.  And, if he gets removed from office, I fear a massive civil uprising.

        • “When you say soldiers are supposed to be apolitical, do you mean that they are legally restricted from publicly expressing a political opinion?”

          Yes, they are actually.  Members of the military are expressly forbidden from endorsing specific political candidates in an official capacity.  As you go up in rank, the prohibitions increase as even unofficial personal endorsements can carry too much weight with subordinates.

        • They’re not allowed to express an opinion or favor a political candidate while in uniform and on active duty (and when you’re in the military, you’re on active duty (subject to the UCMJ) 24/7. Their job is to support and defend the Constitution and obey the legal orders of their superiors – not pick and support political candidates or ideologies.

  • I can’t name a far right fringe group, nor can I imagine any lionizing this guy. 

    He’s an idiot, but then again we had a 2LT busted for child porn at Fort Drum last week.  It’s impossible to screen out all the idiots, and I’m going to stop right here lest I get carried away with an obvious comparison.

  • Bruce, I think you’re wrong on this.
    I’ll ask the simplest of questions- Why wasn’t this resolved LONG ago?
    Obvious answer… there’s a problem.

    The military chain of command is in question because we have not seen proof of Obama’s qualifications  to be CinC.
    This guy has standing to demand proof. He’s putting his ass on the line for all of us, and deserves our support. God Bless Him.

    • This HAS been resolved, and the Chain of Command is NOT in question.

      The SCotUS has said he meets the requirements.  The docs from Hawaii suffice, and thus he is the President, and Commander in Chief.

      This Lt. should be tossed into the stockade, and upon release be drummed out of the Army via a dishonorable discharge.

      • Man made global warming has also been resolved too, Scott. Right?
        The simple fact that we’re talking about this issue means it has NOT been resolved.
        And anyone who thinks it has, (like anthropomorphic global warming),  is plugging their ears and singing Lalalalala.

        • Now you’re just pounding away with sophistry.

          Obama’s citizenship =/= AGW

          He was fairly elected (for, in some areas, certain values of “fair”).  The issue of his citizenship was – properly, I remind you – decided in the Supreme Court.

          Get over it.  He’s in the White House.  You’re starting to sound like the moonbats in 2000.

          • Telling me I cannot question why I have not seen a birth certificate that is not a forgery is EXACTLY like telling me I must accept the fact that man-made global warming is consensus science, Scott, no matter what name you may give it.
            And I’ll “get over it” when this issue is finally settled, as it should have been months ago.

        • So, Greybeard, who placed the birth announcement in the Honolulu paper, and why? 

          Before you answer, ask yourself if the answer sounds like something from the producers of “Loose Change”. 

          • So Phil, where’s the birth certificate?
            I’m repeating myself here.
            WHY CAN HE NOT PRODUCE ONE?

          • “The SCotUS has said he meets the requirements.  The docs from Hawaii suffice, and thus he is the President, and Commander in Chief.”
            Maybe I’m not searching the SCotUS site correctly, but nothing from the Court makes any of those claims. The orders state merely that individual cases or requests were denied without comment; which is vastly different making a decision on the President’s citizenship. Anything from jurisdiction issues to inability to prove direct harm to the plaintiff will cause a case to be rejected even if all the evidence provided is perfectly valid. If there’s a statement from the SCotUS that flat out says he meets all requirements, please correct me.

            As far as the birth announcement goes, there is no need to be thinking about a run for the presidency in order to place it. Merely wanting to make sure that your child is considered an American citizen is enough for women to attempt (sometimes dangerous) illegal border crossings while in the third trimester of pregnancy.

          • Just for clarity, the comments labeled just “Phil” are not from Phil Smith.

        • The simple fact that we’re talking about this issue means it has NOT been resolved

          That’s a plainly idiotic statement.  If I were arguing that the world is flat, would the fact that we were discussing it mean that there’s any doubt about the shape of the earth?

          A fact is a fact, regardless of whether you accept that fact.

          And I’ll “get over it” when this issue is finally settled, as it should have been months ago.

          It has been settled, you just don’t want to accept it.  But that doesn’t make the issue any less settled.

    • As far as I know, Greybeard, it was resolved long ago. Long ago enough that the guy is sitting in the Oval office as the duly elected President of the United States and no one but this LT and a few others are questioning his legitimacy.

  • His concern is legitimate, but he can’t refuse to acknowledge the President’s authority.  First off; even if President Obama cannot constitutionally hold the office, he was sworn in legally. Just as an unconstitutional law is technically valid until repealed, Obama is the Commander-in-Chief. Secondly, somebody has to be acknowledged as CinC.  If he refuses that argument, he should acknowledge Joe Biden as the legitimate President at the moment; and unless told to do otherwise by the courts, Biden’s orders will reflect Obama’s decisions. Effectively meaning no change to the fact orders issued by Obama need to be followed.  Obama and Biden ran as a combined ticket, if the election results are wiped out completely Nancy Pelosi takes over, at least until someone else is sworn in (the previous administration is gone when their terms expire no matter what). I doubt anybody wants that.

     To me it seems to me a lawsuit isn’t the necessary first step. A simple FOIA request for the President’s original birth certificate can be submitted. The military requires certified copy of the original certificate, the same minimal standard is appropriate for the President.  The officials in Hawaii can no longer state that no one outside their office has a “tangible interest in the vital record” now that he has been sworn in as President. Unfortunately, in order to demonstrate a tangible interest, the state officials may demand that the requestor be active-duty. If that request is refused, then a lawsuit would be required.

  • I am not a barracks lawyer.
    That being said I believe the following:
    a.  He has the right fo file suit.
    b.  He doesnt have the right to call the President an imposter.
    c.  If he did sue then he should not publicize the suit as it affects moral eand provides distractions to his position.
    d. He should inform his chain of the law suit.
    e.  He should continue to obey all legal orders until such time the suit is settled and after the suit is settled.

    The military gives up a lot of their rights.  If he feels that strongly then there actions he can take.  However, it should be done so as to not affect the mission.

  • Bounce him.   We’re to infer a Lt can question something at this level when all the way down from the Joint Chiefs to his CO no one ELSE is demanding an answer to this question?  Aside from not liking his CinC, what has he been asked to do by the CinC that appears to be inconsistent or illegal with his orders prior to Jan 21 2009?  And as pointed out, which part of Supreme Court doesn’t this guy get.  What court WILL he accept an answer from?  What authority WILL he acknowledge to validate this.  Does he want to review the original copies of the birth certificate himself?  What?  What will satisfy him that Obama is the legitimate CinC if the blessing of the Supreme Court doesn’t?  
    If you’re not asking yourself what answer will he accpet you haven’t given this much thought, because it appears he’s already decided that the normally recognized authorities are WRONG.   So who can give him his answer, provided that answer is NOT that Obama is not qualified to be President?

    • Okay, let’s attack this from a different direction.
      Suppose… (even if it’s a stretch), Obama is not a U.S. citizen. (And given this situation, the fact that the Supreme Court thinks he is means nothing to me.)
      But if he is not a citizen, he is NOT QUALIFIED to be President of the United States… not qualified to be CinC.
      I’m beating my head against a wall here. All he has to do is produce his birth certificate. I can do that. You can do that. Why can he not do it?
      No matter what you name-calling guys might say, there IS a question as to whether or not the certificate produced by (VERY Democrat) Hawaii officials is a forgery.
      PRODUCE THE DAMN BIRTH CERTIFICATE!

      • Seriously, I think you need to talk to your doctor.  I think your medication levels are off…

      • I’m beating my head against a wall here.

        That you are.  Just like the libs beat their heads against the wall for 8 years, screaming about how Bush was  “selected, not elected” and was the “Resident in Chief.”

        Regardless of the rightness or wrongness of the issue, it is a marginal issue that will never derail the Obama steam train.  The point of attack is on policy, not fringe issues.  The man has put his hand on the Bible and taken the oath of office.  He is not going to be unseated on a technicality.

        Think of it as a football game.  If a technical foul doesn’t get called, are you going to keep pushing the issue with the refs, or get back on the field and take back the ball?

  • 2LT’s do stupid things.  It’s why they are put on the earth.

    I agree with McQ: the guy should get a good talking to along the lines of “STFU”, and if he continues this foolishness, he should be kicked out.

    Whether TAO is not legally eligible to be president (God help us) is NOT this guy’s concern, any more than it’s the concern of one of his soldiers whether HE is legally eligible to be an officer.  If he’s so bloody unhappy being in the Army with TAO as the CinC, then he should resign and pursue his legal case as a civilian.

  • I don’t want to get into the Birth Certificate issue, but it happens I was born in Hawaii, when it was a territory.  My Certificate of Live Birth has the date/time I was born, my parents, and the signature of the attending physician verifying the fact that I was born at the time/ place listed.

    The Certificate that was posted on the internet re: Obama did not have the signature/name of the attending phyisician, at least the ones I saw. 

    • Don,

      Hawaii’s Department of Health has two forms of Birth Certificate.  The one of Obama’s you’ve seen is the shorter form.  It contains the date, time, and place of birth, as well as the parents’ names and a few other details.  It is sufficient proof that Obama is a natural born citizen.  The name of the hospital or the attending physician are not needed.

  • Yeah, <a href=”http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?pageId=79174″>this</a> is helpful!
    (And reinforces why I choose to act like a “wingnut”!

  • Okay, here’s the link”:
    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?pageId=79174

    Obviously, this puts all the questions to rest, right?
    Smoke! Fire?

  • His mother was a US citizen and there is NO doubt about that.
    Children born of US citizens abroad ARE considered citzens of the United States.  I don’t care if the woman was on the moon when it happened.

  • Or are we no proposing that, knowing he would one day be President of the United States, the Chicoms, (or the Russians, or maybe it was the Supreme Advanced Vanguard from Rigel-beta Epsilon Tau Ceti 5) cleverly made it appear his mother had a child who could be considered a US citizen, when in fact, she did not.  And Lt Clouseau here is the ONLY man who can uncover the nefarious,  and one must admit, very elaborate plot that it took over 46 years to bring to fruition.

    • Actually, there are one or two very simple (and completely seperate) plots put forth, both of which are quite reasonable. 1st, his parents wanted to make sure he had American citzenship, which is a plot engaged in daily by immigrants wanting their children to have a better life.  Thus the announcement in the paper and possibly a forged birth certificate.
        If (and only if) the original birth certificate did not list him as an American citizen, a second plot would be needed to produce the document that was released to the public. That plot plot would only require one person, the state of Hawaii official that verified the existence of the original.
      That’s it, a grand total of two accomplises at the very most. Every other person that could be complicit is a relative of the President; and they’ve either passed away or stated that he was indeed born in Kenya.

  • If it were me, and people were rabidly questioning my legitimacy to hold the highest office in the land, I’d probably submit for public perusal the barest minimum evidence as well.  Because “f- you.”  And then I’d sit back and watch the extreme right-wing fringe eat away at itself, taking any legitimate debate about my presidency with it.  I’d also be very disappointed that mainstream conservative talk radio failed to take the bait.

    It’s a DOA as an issue.  We’re not going to win votes by meandering off point and into obscure legalistic arguments.  No. One. Cares.

  • And gee…the NERVE of the state of Hawaii stopping people who have no legal right to a copy of Obama’s birth certificate from getting one!  Wow!  What a concept.  Pretty soon if we’re not careful they’ll be doing that to just any old birth certficate!  oh….wait…….

  • Yeah, gee! A big chunk of the population thinks you are illegitimate and not qualified to be President, so let’s not produce a simple document showing they’re a bunch of idiots, while the country tears itself apart.
    That’s definitely something the “Supreme Advanced Vanguard from Rigel-beta Epsilon Tau Ceti 5″ would do!
    Or maybe just a 2LT that wants proof he is taking orders from a legitimate commander?
    Laugh all you want. This President could put all this to rest quite simply, yet he hasn’t.
    Why?

  • Pretty simple, because he doesn’t have to answer to a freaking butterbar.  And based on the reaction I see, I’d say if he DID produce the birth certificate, the crowd that wants one so desperately would launch into how it was a forgery anyway.     Why wreck a good story that’s going NO WHERE.  The only people are going to tear themselves apart over this sometimes line their headgear with tin foil.
    Which part of his US Citizen mother conferring citizenship on him by birth don’t you people get?  If someone was going to foist a fake president off on us do you SERIOUSLY think they wouldn’t be able to provide a birth certificate that wouldn’t pass muster?  Who do you think is in charge of this vast conspiracy to foist off a phony President, Laurel and Hardy?  This is the show stopper?  This is the big proof that he’s not REALLY the President?  A document that a half competent wetback could create, and THAT’S what’s going to satisfy you all that he really IS  or is NOT President?   Color me doubtful.

  • He is taking orders from a legitimate commander, or maybe not…maybe he should demand to see his captain’s commission too, just to be on the safe side, and so on up the chain.  After all, the Supreme Advance Vanguard may have slipped up somewhere there on the forging of their documentation to fool this guy into following orders from someone who’s not really in charge.  Clearly this guy is on the case though, and I suspect that even as we speak ships have been dispatched bearing the properly forged documents, and somewhere a lackey is being punished for failing to provide a forged authentic looking birth certificate back 45 years ago.   Laurel, or is it Hardy, is probably very angry, and when Laurel, or is it Hardy, get angry, people die!

  • Okay, I’m over the top.  The guy is serving and for that I should thank him.  But that doesn’t excuse him from acting like a knucklehead any more than Kerry’s service makes up for what he did when he got home or Murtha’s service excuses his various outbursts.  This guy is wrong.

  • Does the LT have the RIGHT to sue?

    Yes.  You can try to bring suit against anyone for anything.

    Does he have the right to let it interfere with his mission?  no
    Does he have the right to go blabbing to the press and everyone else?  Very questionable.
    The question of wehther Obama should have to show his certificate is a matter for the courts to decide.   The question of whether the LT can sue is beyond question.    The matter of the actions the LT takes other wise is a matter for his immediate CDR to resolve.
    In my mind it isnt the issue of the suit.  It is the issue of the LT actions other than bringing the suit and how it affects the mission.    Personally I think that Obama is a US citizen.  But as has been stated, we are required to show birth certifications for a plethora of reasons.  Obama has refused to show his birth certifictate.  Until he does the question will persist.  The same way the question persist about Kerry’s military records.

    The quickest way for Obama to make this go away is to show his birth certificate.  Until he does questions will persist.  I remember when folks were saying Cheney wasnt qualified to be Vp becuase he came from the same state as Bush even though he had registered to vote in Montana.    Per the constitution the President nad Vp cant be from the same state.  This is along that line.

     

  • >>Children born of US citizens abroad ARE considered citzens of the United States.  I don’t care if the woman was on the moon when it happened.>>

    This is true now, but it was not true when Obama was born.  At that time, the citizen parent had to have been  a US resident for 5 years after the age of 16.  His mother was 18 when she gave birth to Obama, and could therefore not have passed on the natural born citizenship as required by the Constitution.  (this is the question that arises only if he was born outside of Hawaii)

    Hawaii has two birth certificate forms…a Birth Certificate, and a Certificate of Live Birth.  One of them is issued by a hospital where the baby is born, and is signed by a physician (midwife or whatever)who witnessed the birth.   The second is issued upon request of immediate family to an infant of someone who has been a resident of the state for one year prior to birth, no matter where the child is born.  We don’t know which was issued to Obama (whose name is actually Sotero, since he was adopted by his mother’s second husband – which is another kettle of fish) because he hasn’t submitted the vault copy.

    • So the second version would be issues if the mother was a resident of the state?

      Then he was born in the US, and fulfills the requirements.  The other argument is if she were out of the country and gave birth to Obama.

    • This is true now, but it was not true when Obama was born

      When Congress changed the law, it was made retroactive to 1952 (maybe 1951, but in any case, long before Obama was born).

      The second is issued upon request of immediate family to an infant of someone who has been a resident of the state for one year prior to birth, no matter where the child is born.

      Even if what you say is true, the form does not falsify the place of birth.  That is, the form contains the correct place of birth.  Which, in the case of Obama’s form, is Honolulu.

      Tell ya what:  find the cite in Hawaii Revised Statutes that supports your position.

  • I think there are three questions here:
    1) is the guy a citizen:  I’d say “no, that remains to be proven”.   As much as we deny it the fact remains that a large portion of the population still consider it an issue.  Personally I see it as a bastardization of the constitution and not a “fringe issue”.  I don’t care that the guy is the president and  I don’t see this as “a way to get rid of him” I see it as a corruption of the document that this country as built on.  I think it’s damned impotant.
    2) is the guy “duly appointed”.  Yes.  He was sworn in and handed the keys to the castle.   Whether his legal right to be there is in question or not, he IS duly appointed.
    3) Does a 2LT have the right to question that?  No.  Not in any way.  It’s OUR job as American citizens to question that.  It’s his job to follow our guidance.  If we have failed and allowed a non-american to be sworn into office then it’s our failure and not his.  It’s our job to correct the situation and not his.  His job is to do what  we tell him and that, for the moment, is to follow the orders given to him by King Barrack.

  • >>Then he was born in the US, and fulfills the requirements.  The other argument is if she were out of the country and gave birth to Obama.>>

    I think you missed a few words there…and I’m not sure which.  I don’t know which birth certificate is which, but obviously whatever title is given to it, if his birth in Hawaii is witnessed, there is no question – he is a natural born citizen (actually, there are other issues, but they’re a bit involved legally and are related to his adoption and whether he used an Indonesian passport when he traveled to Pakistan).  The second possibility is that he was born in Kenya, and his grandparents (probably) applied for the birth certificate in Hawaii.  That would be why the birth certificate says his race is “African” instead of Negro, which would have been common at the time.  But in reality – we don’t know.  That’s why we want to see the vault copy of the certificate, and why we wonder why he doesn’t produce it.

  • Ah, Worldnetdaily. ’nuff said.

    • Ahh timactual… just the guy I’m looking for.
      You obviously are a superior intellect, so maybe you can help me…
      As a Viet Nam Vet, I’m pretty sure I know why Kerry didn’t release his records as promise. It would have meant the end of his career.
      So why won’t Obama release the “Vault Copy” of his Birth Certificate?
      And please, just answer that question. I don’t need to be told what everyone else has decided.
      (And thanks ahead of time. It’s nice to have geniuses like you on our team!)

      • Why won’t Obama release the “vault copy” of his birth certificate?

        BECAUSE HE DOESN’T HAVE TO.  His citizenship at birth has already been proved.

  • Oh, is that so?
    Then you Steverino, you think Brig. General Jones and Maj. General Childers are, like me, nutjobs?
    ‘Cause they disagree with you.

    • I’ll thank you to refrain from the name-calling, Greybeard.  I never said anyone was a nutjob.  However, the fact of Obama’s birth in the US has been proved.  The State of Hawaii has certified it.  Now, if you want to claim that Hawaii has engaged in falsifying birth records, please provide hard evidence of such a claim.  If, however, you admit that Hawaii did not falsify birth records, then you have a very large obstacle to overcome.

      Even if you don’t accept that Obama really was born in the US, the fact remains that Obama’s mother was a US citizen at the time of his birth, and that makes Obama a citizen at birth, no matter where he was born.

      How many different ways do you have to be proven wrong before you give this up?

  • Once.
    Hasn’t happened yet.
    And you didn’t answer my question…
    What’s he hiding? Why won’t he provide the actual birth certificate?

  • >>The State of Hawaii has certified it. >>

    No. Not true.  The State of Hawaii has stated that they do in fact have a birth certificate on record for the man we know as Barack Obama. 

    >> Now, if you want to claim that Hawaii has engaged in falsifying birth records, please provide hard evidence of such a claim.>>

    No one is claiming that Hawaii has falsified birth records, but since they have two forms, they have also not stated which form they have on record.

    >>Even if you don’t accept that Obama really was born in the US, the fact remains that Obama’s mother was a US citizen at the time of his birth, and that makes Obama a citizen at birth, no matter where he was born.>>

    Also not true.  See my reply #22.

    >>How many different ways do you have to be proven wrong before you give this up?>>

    Ditto.

    • Once.
      Hasn’t happened yet.

      Please answer this question:  was Obama’s mother a US citizen at the time of his birth?

      What’s he hiding? Why won’t he provide the actual birth certificate?

      I don’t know what he’s hiding.  I don’t even know that he’s hiding anything.  My opinion of this is irrelevant.  What is relevant is whether Obama is a natural born citizen, and the facts indicate that he is.

      I don’t know why he won’t produce the “actual” birth certificate.  Again, my opinion of why he hasn’t doesn’t matter.  Obama has produced the short-form birth certificate, which shows he was born in Honolulu.  Barring rebuttal, that is legally sufficient to prove his eligibility for office.

      No. Not true.  The State of Hawaii has stated that they do in fact have a birth certificate on record for the man we know as Barack Obama.

      Yes, it is true.  The CERTIFICATION of Live Birth means that the State has CERTIFIED it.  Unless you’re going to argue that certification doesn’t mean what it really means.

      No one is claiming that Hawaii has falsified birth records, but since they have two forms, they have also not stated which form they have on record.

      The COLB is generated from a database of information taken from birth records.  It is a short form of the original birth record.  Everything on the COLB comes from the original birth record.

      The COLB lists Obama’s place of birth as Honolulu, Hawaii, and the state has certified that form.  If that is not the actual place of Obama’s birth, then what you are claiming is that the State of Hawaii has falsified Obama’s birth record.  If Hawaii did not falsify the information on the COLB, then you must concede that Obama really was born in Honolulu, Hawaii.

      Also not true.  See my reply #22.

      And please see my rebuttal to your reply #22.  When Congress changed the law, it was made retroactive to a period before Obama’s birth.  Unless you want to claim that Obama was really born before 1951, or that Congress really didn’t change the law, or that somehow the law didn’t apply to Obama, you don’t have a leg to stand on.

  • I notice that Greybeard, once full of bluster and demanding answers to his questions, hasn’t answered the one I put to him.

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