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Thank the good Lord ...
Posted by: McQ on Wednesday, January 24, 2007

Acknowledging the obvious, even to him, John Kerry said no bid in '08:
An emotional Senator John F. Kerry today said he will not run in the 2008 presidential race and vowed to use his Senate perch to hasten an end to the war in Iraq, saying he would work with lawmakers from both parties to reverse President Bush's troop "surge" and force him to withdraw virtually all troops from Iraq by early next year.
Yes folks, that made my day. Meanwhile, as noticed by Wonkette, Harry Reid went a little, well, wonky today:
“So I say to John Kerry, I love you John Kerry. And I’m so sorry that things didn’t work out for our country, but that doesn’t take away from the fact that I will always care about you greatly and remember the times we’ve spent together.”
Not that there's anything wrong with that.
 
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Previous Comments to this Post 

Comments
You may notice he didn’t promise he was gonna shut up for the next two years.
 
Written By: Bithead
URL: http://
I wondered why the long face.
 
Written By: coaster
URL: http://
You may notice he didn’t promise he was gonna shut up for the next two years.
Nope, you can still make mountains out of the slightest verbal miscues and accept any unsubstantiated claims as long as they make him look bad.

Cap
 
Written By: Captin Sarcastic
URL: http://
...accept any unsubstantiated claims...
Really? I’m not sure who you think is making unsubstantiated claims, but for the most part I think it was Kerry.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
And I was so looking forward to Kerry taking on the Switboat Veterans for Truth.

Hey .. he still can. So John fill out that form 180 and let the truth start to spread across the land.

“The truth shall set you free.”
 
Written By: Neo
URL: http://
The Swift Boat Liars for Bush have stained every decorated serviceman in American, including my father... they can all go do what Dick Cheney suggested to Patrick Leahy.

Cap
 
Written By: Captin Sarcastic
URL: http://
The Swift Boat Liars for Bush have stained every decorated serviceman in American, including my father...
Yeah, you obviously know more than I do about all that and probably researched it much more than I have, but with the little I did, I found nothing much to substantiate your allegations about the Swift Boat Vets and a lot to substantiate their allegations.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
The Swift Boat Liars for Bush have stained every decorated serviceman in American
You’re going to have to clarify and justify that one, unless you really know of an organization that goes by the name as shown above.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
An emotional Senator John F. Kerry today said he will not run in the 2008 presidential race and vowed to use his Senate perch to hasten an end to the war in Iraq, saying he would work with lawmakers from both parties to reverse President Bush’s troop "surge" and force him to withdraw virtually all troops from Iraq by early next year.
And just wondering, but does this mean he’ll actually be proposing and voting on legislation during this term as Senator?
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
MCQ" "I found nothing much to substantiate your allegations about the Swift Boat Vets and a lot to substantiate their allegations. "
=====================
Oh, MCQ, your ’researches’ have about as much credibility as Cheney’s continued touting of our success in Iraq. In a bowl of alphabet soup, you would always find the right letters to substantiate your pre-judgment.

Your strategy is to rev up a base of attack dogs, who relish mud slinging fests instead of civil discourse. You indulge in endless attacks on individuals, while decrying the same by the opposition when it points its finger at anyone in your camp.

Here’s a report from the trenches of those who are casting about for solutions to our domestic and foreign problems: You have done an excellent job of turning these independents back to the Democratic party, in revulsion to tactics such as yours. Sadly, these folks are precisely the ones who were becoming disafected with the left’s pie-in-the-sky approach to globalization.

Your best hope for achieving prominence in the political arena is to find libertarian spokespeople who are less vulnerable to being seen as a hate mongering lunatic fringe and who can host dscussions more substantial than character assasinations.

One of the ’trash fish’ and proud of it,





 
Written By: Laime
URL: http://
Oh, MCQ, your ’researches’ have about as much credibility as Cheney’s continued touting of our success in Iraq. In a bowl of alphabet soup, you would always find the right letters to substantiate your pre-judgment.
On a more specific point, what do you know about my "reasearches" on John Kerry v. the SBV?
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
Damn, MCQ,haven’t you figured out this internet commenting thingy yet? He’s using "internet logic."

Your researches led you to a different conclusion than his political leanings led him to. Since he knows the Truth, then your researches were obviously perfunctory and/or performed entirely on the websites of people who hate John Kerry, Mothers, apple pie, puppies and kittens, and all other good things (people like the Swift Boat Veterans).
 
Written By: Terry
URL: http://
MCQ -
The most cursory look at the SBV reveals the backers - prominent supporters of the Republican Party and Bush. Doesn’t that make you wonder about their motivation? Of course, they were leading a popular, in some quarters, smear campaign, which seems to be right up your alley, and therefore credible to your unsceptical eye.
There are also the troublesome Navy records contradicting their claims, but, hey, whhen you have a good smear thing going, why bother with facts?

But, here’s the thing. As is your habit, you avoid the main gist of my comment, which was that your credibility is made suspect by your
obsession with smearing individual personalities.

My bad. I looked for an exhange of ideas in the wrong place. Stupidly, I thought it would help you to acknowledge the validity of some of the concerns of the opposition instead of treating them with scorn. You make the same mistake domestically as Bush does on the world stage. Insults rev up your base but fail to attract converts.

The good news for you is that I give up. I can’t take you seriously any more.
So, no more Laime.
Break out the champagne bottles and laissez les bon temps rouler.
 
Written By: Laime
URL: http://
The most cursory look at the SBV reveals the backers - prominent supporters of the Republican Party and Bush.
And of course, that’s wrong. Naturally you didn’t really go beyond that particular point to the substance of their complaints did you?

What a surprise.

I did. And I did independent research to boot. It’s all available through our in-house search engine.

Of course for you to know that it would take two things you seem unwilling to do - make an effort and actually consider the arguments.

Instead we get this:
The good news for you is that I give up. I can’t take you seriously any more.
All I can say is it isn’t my fault you’re as superficial in your thinking as you are.

Instead of taking the bit and actually answering my question about specifics, you, as usual, dodge the point and blame the messenger. I’m the problem.

Fine.

Whatever.

And as all self-destructive types do, you ban yourself, and, I’m sure, blame me for it.

Again, whatever.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
The most cursory look at the SBV reveals the backers - prominent supporters of the Republican Party and Bush. Doesn’t that make you wonder about their motivation?
Is that all you have? Even if what you say is true, how does that make what the Swift Boat Vets said false? Truth is truth, no matter who is supporing you.
 
Written By: steverino
URL: http://steverino.journalspace.com/
Wow
One last go at the already gone Kerry was the magic huh?
le drame magnifique
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
The most cursory look at the SBV reveals the backers - prominent supporters of the Republican Party and Bush. Doesn’t that make you wonder about their motivation?
See, I told you. Internet logic.
 
Written By: Terry
URL: http://
Yeah, you obviously know more than I do about all that and probably researched it much more than I have, but with the little I did, I found nothing much to substantiate your allegations about the Swift Boat Vets and a lot to substantiate their allegations.
I have done a great deal of research on the SBVT, beginning the day they held their first press conference guided by Merrie Spaethm former communications director for the Reagan Administration, at the National Press Club on May 4th 2004, three days after a $400,000 check from T. Boone Pickens cleared in this new organizations bank account.

Let’s just say that the names and dollars behind the group did not prove they were a right wing political hit squad, but it certainly was suspicious.

But the allegations themselves could still have been true regardless of the motives and political alliances of the supporters and members of the group.

But like the CBS Bush TANG documents, with the absence of evidence that the allegations are true, you must rely of the contemporaneous record.

There is NO evidence that the allegations of the SBVT are true, you simply CHOOSE to believe them because you it advanced a goal of yours.

I did not disbelieve them because I liked Kerry, I disbelieved them because when someone wants to change the record of 40 years ago, they need to bring more to the table than just their say so.

No matter how you slice or parse it, it is just a bunch of guys trying to convince America that the military gave out medals for nothing to John Kerry, and by implication, they have stained every decorated serviceman in America.

Here are a couple of decent sites with lots of information that did not sway you in your "research".

Truth and Unfit for Command

Swift Vets and POWs for "Truth" v. The Truth

Cap
 
Written By: Captin Sarcastic
URL: http://
"The Swift Boat Liars for Bush have stained every decorated serviceman in American, including my father..."

Some of those decorated servicemen disagree, as I am absolutely sure my father would, if he were alive today.

*****************************

"the main gist of my comment, which was that your credibility is made suspect by your
obsession with smearing individual personalities.

My bad. I looked for an exhange of ideas in the wrong place"

LOL. An interesting definition of "exchange of ideas". Also, I think I know where you were looking, and it is too dark to see any ideas there.

"My bad."

Ah, something we can all agree on. That’s progress. Who says we can’t have a meeting of the minds?

**************************
"But like the CBS Bush TANG documents, with the absence of evidence that the allegations are true,"

These were eywitness accounts, just what kind of supporting evidence are you thinking of? More eyewitness accounts?

"There is NO evidence that the allegations of the SBVT are true,"

Other than, of course, the eyewitness testimony of the SBVT themselves. But that doesn’t count, since they are all liars. Why? I guess they are just evil.

"it is just a bunch of guys trying to convince America that the military gave out medals for nothing to John Kerry, and by implication, they have stained every decorated serviceman in America"

Sadly, the military did give out bunches of medals for basically nothing, and it does indeed tarnish the ones actually earned. Kerry is just one example of "decoration inflation".

I looked at your links, and they are not impressive, particularly the second one which seems to be limited to calling the SBVT names.

Add another lying swabby to the list, this one from the Gridley.
http://home.nycap.rr.com/pwcarter/the%20kerry%20page.html


 
Written By: timactual
URL: http://
Other than, of course, the eyewitness testimony of the SBVT themselves.
No, what you have are people who are DENYING the OFFICIAL contemporaenous eyewitness accounts and trying to replace them with new accounts, 40 years later and CALLING them eyewitness account. And their NEW accounts are contradicted by not only NAVY records, but also by others that were involved in the actions, and the main assertion by the SBVT is that Kerry wrote the reports, even though there is no evidence to support this assertion, and there is evidence to suggests otherwise.

It helped you win, and I suppose as long as you deny the reality that for you, the ends justified the means, you may be able to sleep at night.

If I did something as despicable, or supported something as despicable as the SBVT attacks, I would hate myself, even if helped get something I wanted.

I’m glad I’m not you, because one day you are going to face the truth, and it’s going to hurt.

Oh, and the first column of your link....
There is no question that John Kerry earned his decorations and that he put his life at risk in the service of his country. There is no doubt in my mind, moreover, that he has the intelligence to serve as president. But there is also no doubt in my mind that his anti-war activities while our troops were still fighting, dying and being tortured in filthy Vietnam prisons were despicable.


This I can respect, an honest disagreement over Kerry’s post war activities. I think he could have done a better job myself. But this is afar cry from contradicting the official record and lying about Kerry writing it.


Cap

 
Written By: Captin Sarcastic
URL: http://
No matter how you slice or parse it, it is just a bunch of guys trying to convince America that the military gave out medals for nothing to John Kerry, and by implication, they have stained every decorated serviceman in America.
That’s not at all what they contended and you know it. But what was clear after researching it was that 2 of the PHs were definitely questionable at best (and especially the first).

Also very questionable was the Bronze Star given for the alleged ambush and rescue.

I supported his Silver Star and had no problem with the 2nd PH.

Also his supposed trip to Cambodia was ludicrous.

My conclusions came from looking at each incident/event and researching them in detail. My guess is you have no idea of how I reached my conclusions since you haven’t bothered to read them.

But the SBV did no such thing. They had legitimate points and legitimate gripes.

The guy who did the smearing was Kerry when he pitched someone elses medals over the WH fence and called them his own, participated in the farce of the Winter Soldier and gave his testimony before the Senate which implied that atrocities were a part of the everyday life of soldiers and not only known but supported by the chain of command.

But that’s OK, huh Cap ... that smear apparently is acceptable, right?

Kerry got everything he deserved and still, despite his promise to do so, has yet to sign a form 180 and actually release his military records (and probably never will because, unlike Bush, it may actually show a little AWOL problem).
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
There must have been a lot more magic to Kerry than I ever perceived.
Here I thought he was largely a do nothing, Senator from Mass-wa-two-chets who’s main job was to carry Ted Kennedy’s water in an official capacity. He was nearly as inspiring as Michael Do-taxes as a Presidential candidate, and if his memory of events, like secret missions to Cambodia were to be trusted, he’d be giving speeches on Pearl Harbor day about the Germans bombing the Arizona.
you may be able to sleep at night.
If I did something as despicable, or supported something as despicable as the SBVT attacks, I would hate myself, even if helped get something I wanted.
I’m glad I’m not you, because one day you are going to face the truth, and it’s going to hurt.
Oh yeah, a lot more magic.
And a pop psychology course to boot!
I don’t get people throwing themselves on their swords for this guy, Bill Clinton I could understand, but not Kerry.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
Let’s just say that the names and dollars behind the group did not prove they were a right wing political hit squad, but it certainly was suspicious.
Republicans certainly supported the Swiftees. However, the Swiftees were not motivated by conservative ideology on an interest in Republican politics. Rather, they were motivated by the fact that John Kerry sold vets out after he came home. If John Kerry hadn’t slandered Vietnam War vets back in the day, I suspect that his fellow Swiftees would have supported him by near 100% in 2004. Those who didn’t support him would have likely kept quite. Any questions they had about his behaviour in Vietnam would have been swept under the rug. Kerry brought it all down on himself with his own words.
But like the CBS Bush TANG documents, with the absence of evidence that the allegations are true, you must rely of the contemporaneous record.

There is NO evidence that the allegations of the SBVT are true, you simply CHOOSE to believe them because you it advanced a goal of yours
Xmas in Cambodia was a lie.

Kerry’s own log indicates he had not received enemy fire until AFTER he received his first Purple Heart.

There are several differences between the CBS documents and the Swiftees. One is that Kerry ran based upon his status as a vet, Bush didn’t. Another is that the CBS docs were forgeries, while the Swiftees were correct on several key point, and likely correct on others.

The Swiftees didn’t lie, but CBS did.
No, what you have are people who are DENYING the OFFICIAL contemporaenous eyewitness accounts and trying to replace them with new accounts, 40 years later and CALLING them eyewitness account. And their NEW accounts are contradicted by not only NAVY records, but also by others that were involved in the actions, and the main assertion by the SBVT is that Kerry wrote the reports, even though there is no evidence to support this assertion, and there is evidence to suggests otherwise.
What contemporaenous eyewitness indicates Kerry was in Cambodia?

Kerry’s own "contemporaenous eyewitness account" suggests his first Purple Heart was bogus.

 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
No, what you have are people who are DENYING the OFFICIAL contemporaenous eyewitness accounts and trying to replace them with new accounts, 40 years later and CALLING them eyewitness account. And their NEW accounts are contradicted by not only NAVY records, but also by others that were involved in the actions, and the main assertion by the SBVT is that Kerry wrote the reports, even though there is no evidence to support this assertion, and there is evidence to suggests otherwise.
You mean like the 5,000 yard ambush that never was?

The "hostile fire" surrounding his first PH which even he contradicts in his own log/journal (and of course the rice-in-the-buttocks PH, again absent hostile fire and due to his own ineptitude)?

The Christmas in Cambodia nonsense (they had SEAL units in the same area with much stealthier craft who’s job it was to do what he claims, not to mention there is no record, Navy or otherwise, to support his claim)?

Or how about the crewman who swore to Kerry’s version of events and then was found, via Navy records, not to have even been on the boat when the incident in question happened.

Or perhaps Kerry’s adoption of a story as his own about a particular incident - which in reality, and as documented by Navy records - happened to another Swift Boat commander?

There’s a mountain of evidence that his assertions are nonsense if you actually take the time to look at the Navy records you think support him so well.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
Or how about the crewman who swore to Kerry’s version of events and then was found, via Navy records, not to have even been on the boat when the incident in question happened.

Or perhaps Kerry’s adoption of a story as his own about a particular incident - which in reality, and as documented by Navy records - happened to another Swift Boat commander?
McQ,

Sure that was all false. But it was accurate.

And you have to consider the greater narritive. What’s a few lies, if it furthers a progressive agenda?
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
Not to mention the multiple official versions of the write-ups for his awards.
Some updated long long after the ’contemporaneous’ period had passed, and not to correct factual errors, which is, I understand, usually the only acceptable justification for updating such documents.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
There must have been a lot more magic to Kerry than I ever perceived.
I was never particularly enamored with John Kerry, he was ok, dull, he had that snobby dialect and an odd look, and I disagreed on many issues and my views on this have almost nothing to do with John Kerry and everything to do with what was actually done by whom, and why, not just why some of the Swifiees did it, but why they were extended an elevated platform from which to shout. Remember, I was no fan of Clinton either, but the attacks on him were despicable and should be beneath any of us... but of course there are always people to which the ends justify the means.

All of it combined makes for what is in my opinion the most depsicable political dirty trick in history. And this dirty trick stained every American soldier who was ever decorated.

 
Written By: Captin Sarcastic
URL: http://
All of it combined makes for what is in my opinion the most depsicable political dirty trick in history. And this dirty trick stained every American soldier who was ever decorated.
Well you can keep saying that till the cows come home, but it’s not selling very well to those who’ve actually bothered to look into the SBV charges. And, of course, as stated, when speaking in the context of "history" it totally ignores the outrageous smears and falsehoods perpetrated by Kerry in front of the Senate when he called his military peers murderers, rapers and despoilers by design.

As one guy, a VN vet, wrote, if the SBV charges manage to sink Kerry then that will be the equivalent of the welcome home parade we never had.

I agree. And to see that jerk now bow out of ’08 just makes my freakin’ day.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
"I’m glad I’m not you,"

Me too.


"Oh, and the first column of your link...."

Yes, I read that,but it was written by someone who had no actual knowledge of the circumstances surrounding the decorations since he wasn’t there. I am surprised that you cite it, since you dismiss the opinions of others who you say were not there.

"I think he could have done a better job myself."

A better job? A better job of what?

"And this dirty trick stained every American soldier who was ever decorated."

Amazing how so many of those soldiers thought that Kerry was the stain, and turned their backs on him. But I guess that just means we are all despicable.

"Well you can keep saying that till the cows come home, but it’s not selling very well to those who’ve actually bothered to look into the SBV charges."

Yep, and the more you dig, the more you find. Like that statement I linked to by a sailor who served with him on the Gridley, which supports the pattern of Kerry’s exagerations and "inaccuracies".
 
Written By: timactual
URL: http://

 
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