Meta-Blog

SEARCH QandO

Email:
Jon Henke
Bruce "McQ" McQuain
Dale Franks
Bryan Pick
Billy Hollis
Lance Paddock
MichaelW

BLOGROLL QandO

 
 
Recent Posts
The Ayers Resurrection Tour
Special Friends Get Special Breaks
One Hour
The Hope and Change Express - stalled in the slow lane
Michael Steele New RNC Chairman
Things that make you go "hmmmm"...
Oh yeah, that "rule of law" thing ...
Putting Dollar Signs in Front Of The AGW Hoax
Moving toward a 60 vote majority?
Do As I Say ....
 
 
QandO Newsroom

Newsroom Home Page

US News

US National News
Politics
Business
Science
Technology
Health
Entertainment
Sports
Opinion/Editorial

International News

Top World New
Iraq News
Mideast Conflict

Blogging

Blogpulse Daily Highlights
Daypop Top 40 Links

Regional

Regional News

Publications

News Publications

 
Libby "guilty"
Posted by: McQ on Tuesday, March 06, 2007

Uh, Libby's going to jail:
Former White House aide I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby has been found guilty on four of five counts in his perjury and obstruction of justice trial.

Libby, 56, faces a maximum sentence of 25 years in prison and a fine of $1 million.

Libby was convicted of obstruction of justice, making a false statement and two counts of perjury.

Jurors cleared him of a second count of making a false statement.
There'll be some celebrating among the left tonight. Suddenly perjury is important to them. Yup, apparently Libby won't only have his law license pulled and be allowed to make millions on the speaking circuit. He's actually going to pay for his "crime".
 
TrackBacks
Return to Main Blog Page
 
 

Previous Comments to this Post 

Comments
There’ll be some celebrating among the left tonight.
Wouldn’t this be like the crew of the Pequod celebrating the successful harpooning of a minnow that hung around with Moby Dick?
 
Written By: Robb Allen
URL: http://blog.robballen.com
The Libby conviction is a travesty of justice. How can you lie about an incident that was not a crime in the first place. As I sit here democrats are already releasing statements charging the conviction is proof of the mendacity of Vice President Cheney.

Libby was found not guilty of lying to the FBI. This case should have never been brought. The Prosecutor new in the early days of his investigation theat Valery Plame was not a “covered” CIA agent, so there was no crime, and also knew that the source of the leak was Richard Armitage not Libby. The Persicuter continued the investation to justify his existence and waste of millions of dollars of tax money.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
How can you lie about an incident that was not a crime in the first place.
Didn’t Clinton get indicted for lying about something that wasn’t a crime?
 
Written By: ChrisB
URL: http://
He’s going to jail because he lied about talking to the press? Guess he should have added "and I had an affair" just to give himself the free pass.
 
Written By: Jeff Medcalf
URL: http://www.caerdroia.org/blog
The Libby conviction is a travesty of justice. How can you lie about an incident that was not a crime in the first place. As I sit here democrats are already releasing statements charging the conviction is proof of the mendacity of Vice President Cheney.
Lying under oath to a grand jury about anything is perjury. It doesn’t have to be about a crime. Clinton’s perjury was also about things that weren’t a crime.

Libby was found not guilty of lying to the FBI.


One count.

This case should have never been brought. The Prosecutor new in the early days of his investigation theat Valery Plame was not a “covered” CIA agent, so there was no crime, and also knew that the source of the leak was Richard Armitage not Libby. The Persicuter continued the investation to justify his existence and waste of millions of dollars of tax money.
Irrelevant. If one commits perjury about such an issue and obstructs justice, then one has committed a crime. This has also showed the operation to "sell the war" was based, in part, on hatchet jobs against critics, and attempts to manipulate the press. This verdict exists alongside a lack of trust Americans now have in the Bush administration, and especially Vice President Cheney.

But don’t worry. Libby will manipulate the legal system until after the 2008 election, and then Bush will pardon him. I suspect, though, the real story of the inside machinations of how the Iraq war was sold will continue to come out, and every American should be angered by how the powerful manipulated public opinion, went after critics with a goal of personally destroying and discrediting those who challenged the message, and thus got us into a quagmire that is quite likely the most disastrous foreign policy debacle in our history.
 
Written By: Scott Erb
URL: http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~erb/blog.htm
This has also showed the operation to "sell the war" was based, in part, on hatchet jobs against critics, and attempts to manipulate the press.
No, it doesn’t show that. The criticisms of Joe Wilson and the implicit influence of his wife are irrefutable. It is also irrefutable that Wilson’s testimony to Congress and his report are at odds.

Statements made by prominent Democrats before the war and even before the Bush Administration absolutely and incontrovertibly refute your bald lie that the decision to go to war was based on anything other than reasonably well supported intelligence consonant with the inadvertently incorrect conventional wisdom that Saddam Hussein had massed WMDs in some quantity and the ability and desire to produce more if the sanctions were lifted.

Which bipartisan conventional wisdom was incorrect in solely one respect—that he had massed WMDs. In fact, he had existing WMDs which were unaccounted for, if only owing to poor internal inventory keeping.

In every other respect, the conventional wisdom was correct.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, & pfpp
 
Written By: Tom Perkins
URL: http://
This has also showed the operation to "sell the war" was based, in part, on hatchet jobs against critics, and attempts to manipulate the press.
That sentence alone shows that you have no idea what you’re talking about.
 
Written By: MichaelW
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
Guardian of the liberal narrative, in favor of investigating non-crimes with Grand Juries.

Yessireee, you’re the America I want Scott.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
Libby’s not going to jail. Please.

He’ll draw out the appeals process until the day after the November 2008 elections, at which point he gets pardoned.
 
Written By: Geek, Esq.
URL: http://
Didn’t Clinton get indicted for lying about something that wasn’t a crime?
I’ll split a legal hair here. Clinton was being sued and the civil suit was based on reasonable evidence. That doesn’t mean he should have lost the suit, but he was required to be truthful in allowing them to mount it.

This is different in that Libby is being prosecuted for something for which, as far as I can tell, there was never a reason to pursue the case in the first place. Before questioning people it should at minimum be necessary, it seems to me, for the prosecutor to determine if there is a crime to pursue. Michael may have a reason why that shouldn’t be the case, but I find it very distressing.

I don’t want prosecutors to be unleashed to investigate anything which they don’t like on the hope that for reasons unrelated to a crime, or even lack of knowledge of whether a crime might have been committed (and as in this case in an attempt to protect others) might try and mislead that prosecution. Inevitably the prosecutor will be able to collect a scalp. This will build in an incentive for prosecutors, especially on high profile cases, to go on fishing expeditions hoping to take high profile scalps even though the people are not guilty of anything before the prosecutors swing into action.

In this case it is doubly distressing because from the looks of things Fitzgerald had already determined who was responsible and that it was not a crime before tripping Libby up. The goal was to trip him, or someone, up, not to prosecute or investigate a crime. If there were a potential underlying crime, and if during questioning Libby to determine if he, or others, knew what it was required to know to make the act a crime, Libby had misled the prosecution I would have more sympathy for Fitzgerald’s actions. That doesn’t seem to be the case here. Hence Fitzgerald’s insistence that when he knew such facts is irrelevant.

I don’t see the two as being directly comparable at all, though I am not a Plamaniac.
 
Written By: Lance
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
The quote below doesn’t surprise me at all. It pretty much encapsulates how I felt. It was wrong, but they had to follow the law. The problem was the case being brought. In a way I am proud of the jury, I think jury nullification (if ever) should be used only in drastic situations. I now wish they would scream bloody murder over having to convict him in the first place. From one of the jurors:
He says that there was a lot of sympathy for Scooter Libby among the jurors, and that the case was a step or two down in seriousness from what they originally thought. They didn’t like the case ("This sucks," some said), but they felt their duty was to follow the law, and the proof of lies (referred to as "bad judgment" on Libby’s part) was convincing.
 
Written By: Lance
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
While perjury and obstruction of justice can warrant criminal charges one would hope that common sense would limit the use of such laws to acts that have a material bearing on crimes or civil complaints. I was appalled by the calls to bring Clinton to trial for a minor lie that was immaterial to the outcome of the case; and I was appalled by the trial of Martha Stewart. Libby’s trial is just the latest draconian absurdity of a police-state witch-hunt mentality.

Oh, by the way, we found the Arab nuclear program … in Libya. Mission accomplished!
 
Written By: Jason Pappas
URL: http://libertyandculture.blogspot.com/
I now wish they would scream bloody murder over having to convict him in the first place.
They didn’t have to convict him, and jury nullification should have been done.

If nothing else, if the same standards of guilt were applied both to Libby and to the witnesses against him, they would all be guilty.

Doubt wasn’t merely reasonable in this case.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl & pfpp
 
Written By: Tom Perkins
URL: http://
Libby’s not going to jail. Please.

He’ll draw out the appeals process until the day after the November 2008 elections, at which point he gets pardoned.
Bingo.
 
Written By: MichaelW
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
El jefe limpia afortunadamente su asno con la constitución y señor Libby pronto estará libre. El dios bendice América
 
Written By: USA Numero Uno!
URL: http://
Before questioning people it should at minimum be necessary, it seems to me, for the prosecutor to determine if there is a crime to pursue. Michael may have a reason why that shouldn’t be the case, but I find it very distressing.
Well, he can’t very well determine if a crime was committed without questioning people. Of course, in this instance Fitzgerald could have stopped after learning that Plame wasn’t covered by the IIPA. Nevertheless, he was charged with investigating the situation (thanks to a rather broad referral from the CIA) and he did his job. You may hear a lot of anti-Fitz commentary in the coming days (I still hear it about Judge Starr), but as far as I can tell, Fitz did was he was asked to do.
 
Written By: MichaelW
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
El jefe limpia afortunadamente su asno con la constitución y señor Libby pronto estará libre. El dios bendice América
Wow, ignorant sarcasm is already useless, but adding the touch of having it in another language, and it’s double plus useless.
 
Written By: ChrisB
URL: http://
I think jury nullification (if ever) should be used only in drastic situations.
I would very much appreciate your sometime making a vigorous defense of that proposition, especially the "if ever" throwaway.

Not here and now, of course.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, & pfpp
 
Written By: Tom Perkins
URL: http://
Scott,
There is a difference between bad memory and a deliberate lie. Clinton’s perjury was a deliberate lie. Libby’s seems to be the result of bad memory. Hell, I can’t remember a conversation I had last week. Then again I’m “Older than Dirt”.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
I suspect, though, the real story of the inside machinations of how the Iraq war was sold will continue to come out, and every American should be angered by how the powerful manipulated public opinion, went after critics with a goal of personally destroying and discrediting those who challenged the message, and thus got us into a quagmire that is quite likely the most disastrous foreign policy debacle in our history.
Well, it isn’t like Wilson/Plame lied, or anything. Or did they? But that doesn’t fit in with your meme, right?
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
Assuming Libby’s memory was rock-solid even though the witnesses’ were not, then he’s committed the same crime as Clinton and Nixon. Luckily the press isn’t biased or only two of those three would be vilified for it.
 
Written By: Ted
URL: http://
Forget Clinton. Remember Martha Stewart.

The lesson is to refuse to cooperate with agents of the Federal government. It pains me to say that, but we have two examples of people who face legal consequences despite not being convicted of, or in Libby’s case even charged with, a crime. What kind of country is this becoming?
 
Written By: MarkD
URL: http://

There is a difference between bad memory and a deliberate lie. Clinton’s perjury was a deliberate lie. Libby’s seems to be the result of bad memory
That’s not a credible claim. This clearly was a political hatchet job being done to Wilson as a response to his criticism of policy. Libby knew what he was doing. He knew he was lying. The jury clearly didn’t buy it. I think your reflects your partisanship, not the facts of the case.

My view: powerful people should be held to a high standard, and if they commit perjury or obstruct justice in any way, they should be held accountable, whether they have a "D" or an "R" by their name, whether their name is Clinton or Libby.

Moral principles are much easier to hold when one doesn’t let them get determined by partisanship. But these days partisanship seems to come first for most people.
 
Written By: Scott Erb
URL: http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~erb/blog.htm
This clearly was a political hatchet job being done to Wilson as a response to his criticism of policy.
You’re going to have to prove this, because it is not clear at all for anyone here.
 
Written By: ChrisB
URL: http://
This clearly was a political hatchet job being done to Wilson as a response to his criticism of policy.
Don’t you mean in response to the blatant lies told by Wilson:
Former ambassador Joseph C. Wilson IV, dispatched by the CIA in February 2002 to investigate reports that Iraq sought to reconstitute its nuclear weapons program with uranium from Africa, was specifically recommended for the mission by his wife, a CIA employee, contrary to what he has said publicly.

Wilson last year launched a public firestorm with his accusations that the administration had manipulated intelligence to build a case for war. He has said that his trip to Niger should have laid to rest any notion that Iraq sought uranium there and has said his findings were ignored by the White House.

Wilson’s assertions — both about what he found in Niger and what the Bush administration did with the information — were undermined yesterday in a bipartisan Senate intelligence committee report.

The panel found that Wilson’s report, rather than debunking intelligence about purported uranium sales to Iraq, as he has said, bolstered the case for most intelligence analysts. And contrary to Wilson’s assertions and even the government’s previous statements, the CIA did not tell the White House it had qualms about the reliability of the Africa intelligence that made its way into 16 fateful words in President Bush’s January 2003 State of the Union address.

Yesterday’s report said that whether Iraq sought to buy lightly enriched "yellowcake" uranium from Niger is one of the few bits of prewar intelligence that remains an open question. Much of the rest of the intelligence suggesting a buildup of weapons of mass destruction was unfounded, the report said.

The report turns a harsh spotlight on what Wilson has said about his role in gathering prewar intelligence, most pointedly by asserting that his wife, CIA employee Valerie Plame, recommended him.
 
Written By: MichaelW
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
This clearly was a political hatchet job being done to Wilson as a response to his criticism of policy
Actually, it was Wilson and his allies who did the political hatchet job to Bush and Cheney as a result of their opposition to Administration policy.

By all rights, Joe Wilson should be swinging from a length of rope for treason, going off the reservation on his own to try to derail set policy of the Administration.

In the meantime, the left can take 5 minutes away from offering meaningless resolutions and non-viable anti-war plans to cheer this meaningless victory.

Congrats lefties! All your IMPEACH BUSH hysteria culminates in a functionary named Scooter. Who will be pardoned.

Rove still unindicted btw.
 
Written By: shark
URL: http://
Don’t you mean in response to the blatant lies told by Wilson.
Yaknow, for Erb, "Not In The Face", needs to be an acronym.

NITF.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, & pfpp
 
Written By: Tom Perkins
URL: http://
Well, he can’t very well determine if a crime was committed without questioning people. Of course, in this instance Fitzgerald could have stopped after learning that Plame wasn’t covered by the IIPA. Nevertheless, he was charged with investigating the situation (thanks to a rather broad referral from the CIA) and he did his job. You may hear a lot of anti-Fitz commentary in the coming days (I still hear it about Judge Starr), but as far as I can tell, Fitz did was he was asked to do.
I think you and I are starting under different assumptions. I mean that the first thing to be done would be to determine if it was possible for anyone to have committed a crime. Was her position of a nature that would mean that leaking her identity would be a crime? From what I can see, no. Or, one would assume Armitage would be on trial right now. At the point that it is determined it wasn’t a crime Libby should never have been questioned. Once again, maybe I am missing something.

Of course if it was eligible, and he already knew the leaker, the next step would be to determine if the leaker had the requisite knowledge of her protected status. Once again, a fairly narrow point of inquiry. Instead we had a witch hunt and Libby stupidly let himself get caught up in it. Or, that is how it looks to me.

I would very much appreciate your sometime making a vigorous defense of that proposition, especially the "if ever" throwaway.
It is a throwaway because I have conflicting and ill formed beliefs on the matter. Generally though, I want juries following the law. As you can see, I have no vigorous or rigorous argument to make, so my defense would be rather pathetic.
 
Written By: Lance
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com
According to news reports within the last few hours, the jury spent more time questioning why Cheney, Rove and others had not been charged, rather than discussing the case before them. One juror was a working journalist. This brings into question the jury’s motives in finding Libby guilty.

The assertion the outing of Valery Plame was a “Hatchet Job” flies in the face of the evidence. Robert Novak’s source was Richard Armitage, a known critic of the war, not Libby, Rove or Cheney.

The original report of the “African Connection” came from British intelligence, and was identified so in Bush’s state of the union.

Wilson was sent to Africa by the CIA after his wife suggested him for the job. The office of the Vice President did not even know of the trip. Wilson’s report to the CIA differed from his opinion article. It is now know that Iraq had made inquires about yellow cake, but that is as far as it got.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
powerful people should be held to a high standard
I agree, Libby should be held to the same lofty standard as Sandy Berger and punished in a similiar fashion.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
"But these days partisanship seems to come first for most people." - Professor Erb

 
Written By: notherbob2/robert fulton
URL: http://
Love some quotes from the jury:
“I will say there was a tremendous amount of sympathy for Mr. Libby on the jury,” said the juror, Denis Collins, a former newspaper reporter.

“It was said a number of times: ‘What are we doing with this guy here? Where’s Rove? Where are these other guys?’ ” Collins said, referring to Deputy White House Chief of Staff Karl Rove, who was identified during the investigation as one of the senior officials who revealed the identity of the operative, Valerie Plame, to journalists.
He may as well have just said "Somebody’s guilty, put the guy I want infront of me."
 
Written By: Ryan
URL: http://
THE BOTTOM LINE

Before Libby was questioned Fitzgerald knew Richard Armitage was the source of the leak, and told him not to revel that fact. Andrea Mitchell, on the day Novak’s column appeared, said Plame’s connection to the CIA was “well known” among those who covered the intelligence community.

The law prompting the investigation did not apply to anyone who had not been overseas for five years. Plame had been in the U. S. For more than five years, so the law did not apply to her. At that point ethically Fitzgerald should dropped the investigation. Had he done so Libby would never been questioned.

This is one of a long series of cases that prove, if you are questioned by the government, only give your name rank and serial number. If you cooperate in any way, you open yourself to legal consequences.

 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://

By all rights, Joe Wilson should be swinging from a length of rope for treason, going off the reservation on his own to try to derail set policy of the Administration.
No, it is justice that he is right now probably enjoying some wine with friends, laughing at how the attempt to take him down backfired so dramatically. You know Wilson is smiling tonight, there is some justice. And I’m sure when he sees the frustrated insults of right wing bloggers, he smiles more broadly. He’s come out on top. Have a nice evening.
 
Written By: Scott Erb
URL: http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~erb/blog.htm

This is one of a long series of cases that prove, if you are questioned by the government, only give your name rank and serial number. If you cooperate in any way, you open yourself to legal consequences.
No, if you commit perjury and obstruction of justice as part of a plot to smear an opponent you face legal consequences. The guy’s a crook.

That’s been decided by a jury. But given how many people around here refuse to believe a global scientific consensus on global warming and instead scour the internet for scientists who have a view closer to their poitical bias, and then latch on to that as if that somehow undid all the work done by thousands studying this, it’s clear that some people have their minds made up, and the facts will not alter their beliefs no matter what.

Sad.
 
Written By: Scott Erb
URL: http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~erb/blog.htm
Scott,
If you truly believe Al Gore’s Bovine Scatology that humans are responsible for Global Warming, I have some land in Florida and a bridge to Brooklyn for sale. Just contact the Glass Bottom Boat and Reality Company in Miami. Ask for W. T. Hatch.

Fitzgerald committed prosecutorial misconduct by continuing an investigation after realizing no crime had been committed. To prove his worth he had to convict someone of something and it was Libby that became the scapegoat.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
No, it is justice that he is right now probably enjoying some wine with friends, laughing at how the attempt to take him down backfired so dramatically. You know Wilson is smiling tonight, there is some justice. And I’m sure when he sees the frustrated insults of right wing bloggers, he smiles more broadly. He’s come out on top. Have a nice evening.
Actually I did have a nice evening. This has no impact on me in any way except I have another hot topic to posit an opinion on and debate with others about. But you’ve shown just what level you operate on with your "nyah nyah nyah" post.

You may need this stuff to enjoy life, the rest of us non-academice do just fine in the real world.

Have a nice night Scotty
 
Written By: shark
URL: http://
Actually I did have a nice evening. This has no impact on me in any way except I have another hot topic to posit an opinion on and debate with others about. But you’ve shown just what level you operate on with your "nyah nyah nyah" post.

You may need this stuff to enjoy life, the rest of us non-academice do just fine in the real world.

Have a nice night Scotty
I’m just having fun. I’m basically a neoplatonist. The book that best reflects my view of life is Richard Bach’s *Illusions.* I don’t take this seriously.
 
Written By: Scott Erb
URL: http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~erb/blog.htm

 
Add Your Comment
  NOTICE: While we don't wish to censor your thoughts, we do blacklist certain terms of profanity or obscenity. This is not to muzzle you, but to ensure that the blog remains work-safe for our readers. If you wish to use profanity, simply insert asterisks (*) where the vowels usually go. Your meaning will still be clear, but our readers will be able to view the blog without worrying that content monitoring will get them in trouble when reading it.
Comments for this entry are closed.
Name:
Email:
URL:
HTML Tools:
Bold Italic Blockquote Hyperlink
Comment:
   
 
Vicious Capitalism

Divider

Buy Dale's Book!
Slackernomics by Dale Franks

Divider

Divider