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Feminism’s decline: Focusing on the pose and not the problem
Posted by: McQ on Thursday, March 22, 2007

Interesting post over at the Moderate Voice where Shaun Mullen is anything but moderate in his reaction to how some feminist blogs have handled what should be a slam-dunk feminist issue.

The issue is about sexual assault of females in the military. The issue they chose to deal with, has to do with a pose in a picture the alleged victim of such assault dared to agree too for the article on the subject:
I reached this unhappy conclusion while following the latest kerfuffle in the feminist corner of the blogosphere, a silly debate over this photograph of Suzanne Swift that accompanies a New York Times Magazine article on how women returning home from the Iraq War have had to struggle with the violence they experienced, sometimes in the form of sexual assaults.

Swift says that she went AWOL after she was ordered to return to a unit where she was repeatedly sexually assaulted. She was photographed by Katy Grannan in a pose you might see in a Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue. This, claim some feminist bloggers and their posses, is shameless cheesecake and sexually exploitive. I dunno. Suzanne is fully clothed, so maybe it’s because she’s out of uniform.

I’m inclined to tell these scolds to get a life, or better still to focus on the problems so powerfully elucidated in the article, but that would be violating a canon of hard-core feminism.

You see, card-carrying members of this variety of feminism set the rules of political correctness when it comes to all things women, and those who do not play by their rules do so at their own peril. This includes even testosterone-driven old farts such as myself who have worked tirelessly to level the playing field for women during a long career in journalism and blogs about women’s health issues that the mainstream media often ignores.
This is the picture:

Show/Hide


I purposely hid the picture because I wanted you to anticipate what you would see. And my guess it isn't anything like you thought it would be.

Mullen makes the point that feminism, as something worthwhile, is but a mere shadow of itself. In my opinion, it lost its soul during the Clinton era when the feminist movement simply ignored Clinton's excesses (or took his side over that of the alleged victims). Its credibility forever shot, it is a movement now reduced to an old girl's club, more concerned with how someone is posed in a picture than the substance of their complaint.

And as an addendum, rumor has it that all charges will be dropped in the Duke "sexual assault" case. As one emailer said:
One more point: quick tour of the femi-sphere today didn’t show any of them talking about the soon-dropped charges in the Duke case.

Which, really, isn’t surprising at all.
Nope, not surprising at all.
 
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Perhaps they would prefer her to wear a burka.
In my opinion, it lost its soul during the Clinton era when the feminist movement simply ignored Clinton’s excesses (or took his side over that of the alleged victims). Its credibility forever shot, it is now a movement now reduced to an old girl’s club, more concerned with how someone is posed in a picture than the substance of their complaint.
That was amplified by the Clariance Thomas hearings, and the Anita Hill thing.

When you try to hang Thomas for a few alleged comments and shortly thereafter forgive Bill everything including serious rape charges, you should expect to loose credability.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
Ya know, sexual harassment may take many forms. Did hers happen to be being told she’s too ugly to get laid?
 
Written By: Arcs
URL: http://
Did hers happen to be being told she’s too ugly to get laid?
You know, we’ve got this running joke at work. When someone makes an excessively cutting comment, someone else chimes in with an estimate of how many minutes in hell the comment will earn in the after life.

I figure you just got 5 or 10 more.

Bad theology, good humor.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, & pfpp
 
Written By: Tom Perkins
URL: http://
First, it wasn’t harrassment, it was assault. So apparently no, she wasn’t too ugly to get laid...

And second...

I’d hit it...
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
OK, I’m going to take H%!! for this... I don’t think it happened. Call me naive, I find it difficult to believe her chain of command let her be REPEATEDLY assaulted. It’s 2007 not 1967. She may have been a dud as a soldier and wanted a REASON to explain her failure or to forestall separation from service... or she may have been gaming the system sleeping around and then claiming assault. Sorry.
 
Written By: Joe
URL: http://
Maybe "repeated" was twice.

Once being more than enough, maybe she didn’t say anything the 1st time, for whatever reason (shock, fear, hoping it wouldn’t happen again...who knows).

But yeah, they ought to kick her out of the fem club, I mean, look at that pose.
Shocking, why, she almost deserved it, she was just askin for it! Look at her!

 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
OK, I’m going to take H%!! for this... I don’t think it happened. Call me naive, I find it difficult to believe her chain of command let her be REPEATEDLY assaulted. It’s 2007 not 1967. She may have been a dud as a soldier and wanted a REASON to explain her failure or to forestall separation from service... or she may have been gaming the system sleeping around and then claiming assault. Sorry.
Uh, OK. What does that have to do with the topic of feminism and their focus on the pose and not the problem?
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
Perhaps they would prefer her to wear a burka.
I thought real hard about putting a line like that in the post, but ended up thinking it would distract from the point.
 
Written By: McQ
URL: http://www.qando.net/blog
One more point: quick tour of the femi-sphere today didn’t show any of them talking about the soon-dropped charges in the Duke case.

Which, really, isn’t surprising at all.
Hate to disagree but the story is on Fox News and in the right side of the blogosphere. The femi-sphere rarely ventures outside of their protective "womb" to sites that challenge their orthodoxy.

I predict that if the story turns out true and the New York Times covers it, the femi-sphere will rant and rave with the heat of a thousand suns.
 
Written By: Paul L
URL: http://kingdomofidiots.blogspot.com/
Feminism has morphed from a movement to bring equality to Women in areas ranging from respect to pay, to “all men are evil and should be done away with” philosophy of radicals like Andrea Dworkin. Man hating lesbians have hijacked a noble movement. They won’t be satisfied until women grow penises, and give up their sexuality. The brouhahas over these photos are an out growth of that movement.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
I do wonder what the photographer/reporter/editor was thinking with that picture with respect to that story. Walking on the beach looking out to the ocean? Ok - peaceful serenity, trying to get over a difficult past. Lying down on the beach looking at the camera? WTF? And can we imagine them posing a man in that way?

McQ’s right though, it should have been them writing "this is a serious problem in the military and needs to be addressed" with at most an aside of "and WTF is up with that picture?"
 
Written By: Ugh
URL: http://
Nothing McQ, I was commenting on the allegation itself....
McQ’s right though, it should have been them writing "this is a serious problem in the military and needs to be addressed"
And I’m just riffin’ on THAT, that it ISN’T big problem....If you want me to focus on the "little" problem of her pose, OK. I’d rather focus on the BIGGER question of the substance of her allegations.
 
Written By: Joe
URL: http://
And McQ you and the Muellen miss the BIG picture... the reason that Feminists are debating this LITTLE point is that they are in agreement on the BIG point. That sexual assault is a big issue in the military...It goes without saying, OF COURSE she was assaulted....

I don’t even feel like granting them that...and if you look(ed) at it that way, you might argue that whilst the little point is silly, the larger agreement amongst the bloggers is scary... do you believe...not that sexual assault does NOT occur in the military, but that it is a LARGE problem. Say as large as the issue of body armour and how much is issued and how much should be worn? Or on the level of poor food?

How likely is it that she was "repeatedly" assaulted...what does she define as "assault?" that sort of thing. Sure they’re arguing over the window treatment, but that’s because they’ve decided which house to buy.
 
Written By: Joe
URL: http://
It goes without saying, OF COURSE she was assaulted....

Just like the ’victim’ in the Duke rape case?
It goes without saying that Justice should run it’s course before we can have the answer.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
Justice should run it’s course before we can have the answer
Meanwhile they can help trivialize the issue by making a stink about the photo.
Perhaps they really ARE worried that someone will get the wrong idea about her.

Jimminy Christmas.
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
Just like the ’victim’ in the Duke rape case?


You need to read ALL of Joe’s post.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
First, it wasn’t harrassment, it was assault. So apparently no, she wasn’t too ugly to get laid...

And second...

I’d hit it...
I’d probably hit it too.

But I’m agnostic on the charges . . . need more data before I’m saying it happened on not . . .
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
How big are the guys who assaulted her? She’s got some mean looking guns and looks built like a linebacker to me.
 
Written By: Harun
URL: http://
Thanks for hiding the picture . . . it really wasn’t what I expected to see, and definitly has much more "shock value" seeing it this way. Am I missing something? There is supposed to be something wrong with this picture? Huh
 
Written By: Marc
URL: http://
Am I missing something? There is supposed to be something wrong with this picture? Huh
Only if you are a radical feminist.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
"Perhaps they would prefer her to wear a burka."

I would.

"I find it difficult to believe her chain of command let her be REPEATEDLY assaulted."

Dittos, if you will pardon the expression. Of course I think "sexual assault" covers anything from rape to accidentally brushing against someone in an elevator.

" She may have been a dud as a soldier "

Once again, dittos. Fat, slovenly, dirty, and tattooed certainly doesn’t inspire my confidence in either her military prowess or her credibility.
 
Written By: timactual
URL: http://
Man hating lesbians have hijacked a noble movement.

As QandO’s resident feminist (albeit not a radical one), I’d say James E. Fish mostly nails it with this — though I wouldn’t go so far as to characterize the problem as ’man-hating lesbians.’ Some are ’female supremacists’ (of whatever sexual preference). Some simply fall into the fallacy so many on the left do in various areas — confusing equality of opportunity and equality of results.

As far as the picture goes, it’s not a pose I would have picked (those rocks look damned uncomfortable, if nothing else), but I respect her and her right to make that choice. Ironically, that respect — which radical feminists demand at the top of their lungs — is exactly what they don’t give her.
 
Written By: Achillea
URL: http://
"Fat, slovenly, dirty, and tattooed"

Hell, from what my dad says, in Vietnam the last three on that list were almost required for combat ready units... You people need to stop thinking the guys in the movies are what we use to go to war. As one of the ’Murphy’s Rules of Combat’ says: "No combat ready unit ever passed inspection".

And what you call ’fat’, I call "cushion for the pushin’"...

No, I didn’t say that. You imagined it. Move along.

I honestly, and sadly, have no hard time believing she was sexually assaulted. Even if he looked like my ass (and trust me, it ain’t pretty... Sitting on hot metal from welding is not cosmetically enhancing), the low number of women, and what I imagine to be the general inaccessability of local women (I suspect there are few cat houses) leads me to believe that there’s a LOT of preasure. All it takes is a couple of grab-happy GI’s. Now, I don’t think she was raped, but it might not have been too far off. Get a combat situation, high stress, and men want to vent some steam... Sadly, this is one of the ways. Not saying it’s good, just that it happens.

And Achillea... "confusing equality of opportunity and equality of results." is perfect. I’ve long said that if all men are created equal, why aren’t I playing left tackle for the Bears?

Though I would have to say... If they are female supremacists, wouldn’t they HAVE to be lesbians? Would they be willing to sully themselves by allowing a penis entry? ;)
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
As an aside, I don’t think she’s fat. No, she’s not skinny, but would you rather have Kate Moss in combat? She appears to be pretty solid, not fat.

And does anyone know if she’s seeing anyone?

I’m just wonderin’, is all. I, um, know this guy, you see... Yeah... That’s it. My friend wants to know. That’s it...
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
I suspect the real problem is that she has breasts.

There is really nothing overtly sexual about that photo except that her figure is very womanly. By today’s airbrushed standards, she is not a beauty queen, but I think she is not at all unattractive.

Jealousy is an ugly emotion.
 
Written By: Cassandra
URL: http://www.villainouscompany.com/vcblog/
And here I thought enlightened men knew that sexual assault and rape had nothing what-so-ever to do with pleasure or sexual gratification. So, whatever a woman looks like, has little to do with a deviant committing sexual assault or rape on her.

Like many people, the feminists seem to be concerned more with style then substance.
 
Written By: Keith_Indy
URL: http://asecondhandconjecture.com/
"Jealousy is an ugly emotion."

Indeed. Not to denegrate the Movement, but have you ever noticed that a large percentage of the militant feminists are women who’s best chance at finding a man is, shall we say, last call?
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
And here I thought enlightened men knew that sexual assault and rape had nothing what-so-ever to do with pleasure or sexual gratification.


I guess I’m not enlightened. I think rape often does have a lot to do with sexual gratification.
So, whatever a woman looks like, has little to do with a deviant committing sexual assault or rape on her.
1) Just ’cause a girl ain’t pretty don’t mean ya don’t wanna hit it.

2) Some guys have a thing for ugly.

The girl in the picture is a little bit chubby, but more to the point her facial expression is a turn off. She does not look happy. A change of mood would make all the difference, but given the mood I see I think Scott should run far, far away . . .
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
I suspect the real problem is that she has breasts.
That’s all that would make it BOTD material.
There is really nothing overtly sexual about that photo except that her figure is very womanly. By today’s airbrushed standards, she is not a beauty queen, but I think she is not at all unattractive.
Like I said, she’s a little chubby and her facial expression does not flatter her. Of course, a happy expression would not fit in with the story line. The face is very, very important to attractiveness, hence the reaction to her picture by some of the guys here.

 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
First Don, it’s pretty much universal that rape is about the power over the victim, not the sex. Sometimes the power is a turn on, but it’s alway sthe power to force sex.

Happy? You try laying on stones and looking gleeful... Baby just needs some lovin’, man... :)
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
Scott,

How was that determined? Can you cite an actual study of rapists or rape?

I attribute this idea to feminist dogma, not any verifiable reality. Kinda like the claim that "squaw" comes from a word for "vagania" and "rule of thumb" from English rules on wife beating.



 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
How was that determined? Can you cite an actual study of rapists or rape?
Google it, you will find more studies than you can read in a lifetime proving rape is a power trip.
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
If this makes me sound like a prig, so be it. There are a lot of posts in this thread that gives ammunition to the Radical Feminist claim “All Men are Sexist Pigs
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
I tried Google.

I didn’t find anythign that proved anything one way or another.

The evidence I did see tended to reinforce my view that rape is primarly about sex.

If you have a solid study that shows otherwise, let me know.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
One specific link I found was this.

Here is a quote:
Anderson, I., & Swainson, V. (2001). Perceived motivation for rape: Gender differences in beliefs about female and male rape. Current Research in Social Psychology, 6, 107-123.

The present study directs attention to observers’ beliefs and perceptions about male and female rape. To date, there are two explanations for rape motivation; that rape is a sexually motivated act or that rape is an act motivated by power. Data from 120 participants suggests that rape is still regarded as being a crime motivated by sex rather than power. In addition, it is suggested that most men support the view of rape as a sexually motivated act despite the belief that the feminist explanation for rape (i.e., motivated by power) was becoming more acceptable to the general population.

Topics: Male-female relations; myths/stereotypes; perpetration

Archer, J., & Vaughan, A. (2001). Evolutionary theories of rape. Psychology, Evolution & Gender, 3, 95-101.

The purpose of this article is to review and discuss different evolutionary views of rape and their implications. Evolutionary theories are divided into views of rape as an adaptive strategy or as a by-product of other forms of adaptive behavior. These views are often criticized by feminists who support the view that rape is an exercise of power. However, in determining the origins of rape, the authors point out that forced mating has occurred in the animal kingdom predating patriarchal structures thereby weakening the power-related basis of feminist theories.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
If this makes me sound like a prig, so be it. There are a lot of posts in this thread that gives ammunition to the Radical Feminist claim “All Men are Sexist Pigs”
Ya think?
 
Written By: looker
URL: http://
Sexist pig? Not hardly.

At the very least, I don’t think less of women simply because they lack a penis, unlike your typical feminist radical who thinks I’m a rapist simply because I have a wang...
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
"If this makes me sound like a prig, so be it. There are a lot of posts in this thread that gives ammunition to the Radical Feminist claim “All Men are Sexist Pigs”"

It does.
I have long maintained that men are pigs. If I had a daughter, any male that got within 20 feet of her would be in mortal danger. I have, much to my regret, been piggish myself. But it is about the sex, not the power. Many men are more than willing to give women power in return for sex, particulary young hormone-intoxicated males. Many women are inclined to make that trade. My memory of days of yore is still good enough to remember incidents of young(and some not so young) males, myself included, make absolute fools of themselves over sex. Not power, sex.
So, yes, all men are pigs, but not as many of them are sexist in spite of the conventional wisdom. In our culture anyway.
 
Written By: timactual
URL: http://
I have long maintained that men are pigs. If I had a daughter, any male that got within 20 feet of her would be in mortal danger
If you had a daughter I would suggest the following when her first date arrives to take her out. Get a Harley, German helmet from WW2, A Swastika arm band and a big Rambo sized knife. Sit on the hog while wearing the acquitments, while sharpening the knife. As the date walks towards the door tell him “I have only one daughter. I love her very much. I would not want to see anything bad happen to her. You are going to want to hold hands, the perhaps kiss my daughter. At that moment remember, I Don’t mind going back to Prison.”
 
Written By: James E. Fish
URL: http://
... and then, start thinking about the psychiatry bills your daughter will wring out of you after her dates flinch at her touch, and the fact that you won’t be invited to her wedding.

Then again, if you should hold that first handshake with the boy a little harder and a little longer than usual, while staring a thousand yards into his eyes, what’s the harm?
 
Written By: Bryan Pick
URL: http://www.qando.net
I just plan on sitting on the front porch, cleaning a shotgun when my daughter’s date arrives, and passing on a line used by Johnny Cash to the man who became his son-in-law: "I don’t know you well enough to miss you when you’re gone".

That is assuming that when I have a duaghter I’m overruled in my plan to simply lock her in a sealed room from peuberty to menopause...
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://

 
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