Meta-Blog

SEARCH QandO

Email:
Jon Henke
Bruce "McQ" McQuain
Dale Franks
Bryan Pick
Billy Hollis
Lance Paddock
MichaelW

BLOGROLL QandO

 
 
Recent Posts
The Ayers Resurrection Tour
Special Friends Get Special Breaks
One Hour
The Hope and Change Express - stalled in the slow lane
Michael Steele New RNC Chairman
Things that make you go "hmmmm"...
Oh yeah, that "rule of law" thing ...
Putting Dollar Signs in Front Of The AGW Hoax
Moving toward a 60 vote majority?
Do As I Say ....
 
 
QandO Newsroom

Newsroom Home Page

US News

US National News
Politics
Business
Science
Technology
Health
Entertainment
Sports
Opinion/Editorial

International News

Top World New
Iraq News
Mideast Conflict

Blogging

Blogpulse Daily Highlights
Daypop Top 40 Links

Regional

Regional News

Publications

News Publications

 
Legal concealed carry weapon saves man’s life
Posted by: McQ on Tuesday, April 24, 2007

In the wake of the Va Tech tragedy, an incident Cleveland, OH which is of interest. There a concealed weapon probably saved a man from being a victim of armed robbery and possibly death:
Damon Wells is the man gun supporters were imagining when they fought for the right to carry concealed weapons.

He had a permit to carry his gun, and he had the gun on him when a pair of teenage thieves approached him Saturday night on his front porch in Cleveland.

When one of the youths pulled a gun, Wells drew his and shot one of the boys several times in the chest, police said. Arthur Buford, 15, died after stumbling away and collapsing on a sidewalk near East 134th Street and Kinsman Road.

City prosecutors decided Monday that Wells, 25, was justified and would not be charged for what appears to be the first time a concealed-carry permit holder has shot and killed an attacker.

Nonetheless, the shooting reignited the debate that flared three years ago when Ohio's concealed-carry law took effect.

Gun supporters said the weapon saved Wells' life. Opponents said it took Buford's - that the 15-year-old might be alive if a citizen had not been armed.
Of course the opponents seem to miss the fact that Wells could be dead as a result of the gun pulled on him by the 15 year old.

The fact that it was a 15 year old doesn't change the fact that a .38 bullet doesn't care what age the shooter is or the victim when it exits the barrel headed toward its target.

The reaction of some, however, seems to miss that point:
An angry throng of about 30 youths gathered Monday and set up a memorial at the intersection where Buford, a freshman at John F. Kennedy High School, died.

His cousin, Tameka Foster, 21, questioned why police did not punish Buford's shooter.

"They let that man run out freely," Foster said. "My cousin is dead."

Buford's accomplice disappeared after the shooting and had not been caught as of Monday night. Police found a .38-caliber handgun in the mail chute of a nearby house. They believe it belonged to Buford or the other suspect, Lt. Thomas Stacho said.
My guess is had it been Wells laying dead the reaction would have been "but my cousin is just a kid".

Here's the deal - when someone draws a gun on you, you have no other choice but to assume they intend to use it and act accordingly. That's apparently what happened here.

One side says:
"It's tragic," said Jim Irvine, chairman of the Buckeye Firearms Association. "Anytime somebody dies, it's tragic, but it's hard to have any sympathy when he chose to have a gun and go threaten somebody's life."

Irvine said it was "great that a potential victim is able to continue his life instead of having a criminal take it."
Says the other:
Toby Hoover, of the Ohio Coalition Against Gun Violence, said she had not heard of any other fatal shooting involving a concealed-carry permit holder.

"This is one of the few where they actually used it to stop a crime," Hoover said.

But, she said, "there's still a dead kid here."
Yes, there is. And hopefully the incident will warn other predators that there are people out there with legally concealed weapons who will use them and that their previously risk free predation is a thing of the past.
 
TrackBacks
Return to Main Blog Page
 
 

Previous Comments to this Post 

Comments
"there’s still a dead kid here."
No, there’s a dead goblin who happened to be 15.

Good riddance. List his obituary under "Public Improvements."
 
Written By: The Gonzman
URL: http://
Because that man on the porch had it coming, and because my .38 pistol isn’t a pistol, not really, it is my Smith & Wesson Visa card. I pull out my S&W Visa and people give me things...it’s simple. That guy on the porch had "things" and I had my Visa, and so putting the two together I conclude his things can be mine with my Visa. And then dude ruins it all by pulling out HIS pistol and shooting me!

Anyone can see that is wrong! Dudes, what is the matter with all of you? All I did was what anyone with a Visa card would do when they see something they want...and this old man shoots me?! WTF!!!!
 
Written By: Joe
URL: http://
Gonz, dead on... No pun intended.

I hope the guy puts a big poster of Johnny Cash giving the one-figer salute on the side of his house...

Way to go, way to defend yourself.

Note to would-be criminals: Don’t pull a gun on people, and they likely won’t pull one on you. Pull a gun, and you BETTER shoot first, because I know that I will open fire, and likely most others would too.

It should be noted that since he was on his porch, he didn’t NEED a CCW permit. He was on his property, and can carry a weapon however he choses in his own home.
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
It should be noted that since he was on his porch, he didn’t NEED a CCW permit. He was on his property, and can carry a weapon however he choses in his own home.
Unless he’s in some place like D.C. or San Francisco.
 
Written By: Joe
URL: http://
If Wells had been a police officer and Buford had pulled a gun on him, he’d be just as dead and it would be justified. Yes, it’s sad and tragic when someone so young goes astray and throws their life away but as Bruce said bullets do not respect the age of the shooter or the victim. By using a gun Buford put his own life at risk.
 
Written By: John
URL: http://
John, a lot of the time cops hesitate now when someone points a gun at them. They are supposed to REASON with the nut.

REASON with them? TALK THEM DOWN???

Screw that... "Yeah, I attempted to reason with him. I entered into a short debate consisting of short, one-sylable words. The suspect saw his way to my way of thinking, and laid down on the ground whil simutaniously bleeding from multiple holes..."
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
John, a lot of the time cops hesitate now when someone points a gun at them. They are supposed to REASON with the nut.

It’s human to hesitate in the face of danger, but I know quite a few cops that wouldn’t blink in shooting him if they felt their lives were in danger. Bottom line: if you point a gun at someone in a manner that makes them think you are going to shoot, your life is threatened.
 
Written By: John
URL: http://
His cousin, Tameka Foster, 21, questioned why police did not punish Buford’s shooter.

"They let that man run out freely," Foster said. "My cousin is dead."
This pisses me off, this is retarded thinking. If my sister pulled a gun on someone while on their porch and the guy shot her and killed her i wouldnt blame him. I would blame myself for not trying to get my sister whatever help she needed, cause normal people don’t pull guns and rob someone on their porch. I would possibly even apologize to the guy for being put in such a position. The gunman raised the stakes by threatening his life.
 
Written By: josh b
URL: http://
Gun supporters said the weapon saved Wells’ life. Opponents said it took Buford’s - that the 15-year-old might be alive if a citizen had not been armed.
Seems to me that Wells alive is a good thing.

Also seems to me that Buford dead is a good thing.

Win win, if you ask me.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://

Also seems to me that Buford dead is a good thing.

Win win, if you ask me.
This kind of thinking is detrimental to our argument. It is not a good thing that Buford is dead; and it is not win-win.

It is a more desirable outcome that the criminal is stopped -by the victim- in the process of committing his crime; but that does not make it a good thing that the criminal is dead.

This situation -like all other situations in life- is a trade-off: the prevention of a crime at the cost of the 15 year old’s life.
 
Written By: Ike
URL: http://
There a concealed weapon probably saved a man from being a victim of armed robbery and possibly death:
Oh, I can’t help myself.

Guns don’t save people, people save people.
Toby Hoover, of the Ohio Coalition Against Gun Violence, said she had not heard of any other fatal shooting involving a concealed-carry permit holder.

"This is one of the few where they actually used it to stop a crime," Hoover said.
Somebody call her on this. Like, Guncite.
 
Written By: Bryan Pick
URL: http://www.qando.net
I’d imagine Hoover is speaking of locally, but in any case he’s still lying; he’s playing the game of "If you didn’t shoot anybody or at least fire a shot, you didn’t actually use the gun to stop a crime."

So no matter how many robbers/rapists/burglars/murderers were chased away or held for police, those don’t count since you didn’t actually shoot them.
 
Written By: Firehand
URL: http://elmtreeforge.blogspot.com
And yeah, "They let that man run out freely," Foster said. "My cousin is dead." Not a damn word about your cousin running around with weapons robbing people, oh no. That doesn’t count, either.
 
Written By: Firehand
URL: http://elmtreeforge.blogspot.com
Ike: You’re quite right. It didn’t end up win/win; it ended up win/lose: bad guys lose, good guys win.

All’s returned to right, at least for an instant, in that corner of the world.

It’s sad that a 15 year old died, but not wrong; there’s a difference.
 
Written By: Ron Good
URL: http://northernsubverbia.blogspot.com
My take on the cousin:
They let that man run out freely
No, they let him sit at home minding his own business. They let your COUSIN run out freely... There’s a difference.
 
Written By: Scott
URL: http://
This kind of thinking is detrimental to our argument. It is not a good thing that Buford is dead; and it is not win-win.

It is a more desirable outcome that the criminal is stopped -by the victim- in the process of committing his crime; but that does not make it a good thing that the criminal is dead.

This situation -like all other situations in life- is a trade-off: the prevention of a crime at the cost of the 15 year old’s life.

—Ike


From a political perspective, you are probably right. Saying things that are not PC can hurt us.

Yet remaining politically stupid, I still see it as win-win. One less bad guy running around.
It’s sad that a 15 year old died, but not wrong; there’s a difference.

—Ron Good
I agree. But the sad part begins with the 15 year old turnig to crime, not with him being shot.
 
Written By: Don
URL: http://
I think that the "sad but not wrong" point is a good one. And important.

And it’s not about the kid *deserving* to die. It’s that he chose to die.
Maybe he didn’t deserve it at all. He could be a hardened and evil soul and untold people may have been saved by the fact that one of his intended victims shot him dead early on, or he might have made a stupid choice just this once got talked into it by his buddy (who maybe was older and gave the "juvenile" the gun because a kid gets in less trouble in court) and maybe he’d have never done a thing like it again in his life because he was really a "good kid."

It doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter why he made the choice he made to point that gun at someone. He made the choice and *he* chose the outcome.

His death can very well be "sad" without being "wrong."
 
Written By: Synova
URL: http://synova.blogspot.com
An angry throng of about 30 youths gathered Monday and set up a memorial at the intersection where Buford, a freshman at John F. Kennedy High School, died.

His cousin, Tameka Foster, 21, questioned why police did not punish Buford’s shooter.

"They let that man run out freely," Foster said. "My cousin is dead."
Let’s presume the kid’s 30-odd friends are all about the same age, which means at least 6 or more years in school, and they’ve already learned:

a) victims ought to be disarmed,
b) causing death due to self-defence is as criminal as killing someone in a robbery or thuggery attempt,
c) it’s really not about right or wrong, it’s about "my friennnnnnnnnnnnnnds" and "my cuzzins",
d) it’s right to be angry when your friend gets killed threatening somebody, rather than disappointed or shocked he put himself in that situation, and
e) there’s nothing like a public sympathy-ploy demonstration to get your point accross.

Like I said: sad.
 
Written By: Ron Good
URL: http://northernsubverbia.blogspot.com
the sad part begins with the 15 year old turnig to crime
Or, re my last post: the sad part started well before he turned to crime.
 
Written By: Ron Good
URL: http://northernsubverbia.blogspot.com

 
Add Your Comment
  NOTICE: While we don't wish to censor your thoughts, we do blacklist certain terms of profanity or obscenity. This is not to muzzle you, but to ensure that the blog remains work-safe for our readers. If you wish to use profanity, simply insert asterisks (*) where the vowels usually go. Your meaning will still be clear, but our readers will be able to view the blog without worrying that content monitoring will get them in trouble when reading it.
Comments for this entry are closed.
Name:
Email:
URL:
HTML Tools:
Bold Italic Blockquote Hyperlink
Comment:
   
 
Vicious Capitalism

Divider

Buy Dale's Book!
Slackernomics by Dale Franks

Divider

Divider