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Climate change: China - Victim, US - Culprit
Posted by: McQ on Sunday, February 17, 2008

This is an example of how absurd the argument about climate change has become and illustrates why there will be no world wide agreement to cut carbon dioxide emissions unless the US and Europe capitulate to the 'victims':
Negotiations on a new treaty to fight global warming will fail if rich nations are not treated as "culprits" and developing countries as "victims," China's top climate envoy says.

The whole world must take action to confront climate change, but developed countries have a "historical responsibility" to do much more because their unrestrained emissions in the past century are responsible for global warming, Ambassador Yu Qingtai said on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly debate on climate change last week.

"The United States and the developed states as a whole are the countries that created the problem, caused the problem of climate change in the first place. In my view, that's what a culprit means," he said.

The United States and China are the world's biggest emitters of greenhouse gases blamed for global warming.

Washington has argued it should not have to cut its emissions to a level that would hurt the U.S. economy as long as countries like China and India are not required to make similar cuts.

In December, delegations from nearly 190 countries agreed at a conference in Bali, Indonesia, to adopt a blueprint for controlling global warming gases before the end of next year.

Yu said that agreement reiterated a principle of different responsibilities for rich and poor nations.

If it is abandoned, he warned, "people will just disperse and go their own ways and do their own things."
Now, you don't even have to be particularly bright to figure that one out. China, perhaps the biggest net polluter on the planet, is a victim because its repressive regime and Maoist politics hindered economic growth while other economies were streaking ahead of it. Now that it has gotten its head out of its collective posterier as it concerns its economy, it wants the advantage of a free pass while the "culprits" are punished for having relatively free economies and developing them.

This isn't about CO2. It's about political and economic advantage. And I have no confidence that our political leaders, at least those on the left, won't willingly trade it away in the name of "saving the planet".
 
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wow, what a scam.

If it isn’t obvious by then ....

Just wait for the usual suspects to come by.
 
Written By: capt joe
URL: http://
I like this analogy: Much of the environmental movement is a like a watermelon. Green on the outside, red on the inside.

At the same time, China has no problem making money from the Developed countries ill gotten wealth.
 
Written By: jpm100
URL: http://
Liberal fascism indeed!

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there’s no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw.

 
Written By: bains
URL: http://
from Rush The Trees
 
Written By: bains
URL: http://

Now, you don’t even have to be particularly bright to figure that one out. China, perhaps the biggest net polluter on the planet, is a victim because its repressive regime and Maoist politics hindered economic growth while other economies were streaking ahead of it.
?

China is a larger net polluter because the U. S. and Europe have been exporting their manufacturing, which tends to be more polluting than service industries, to China for the last quarter century. I don’t see either China or the West as victims or culprits in this. All parties have been making the shrewdest economic moves they could under the circumstances although I tend to think that China has played their economic hand a little more shrewdly than we have.

Since abandoning Maoism, again about a quarter century ago, China’s economy has grown enormously and the amount of pollution it’s created has grown hand-in-hand with that economic growth for the reasons I mentioned above.

China’s ruling regime is unquestionably among the world’s most oppressive, corrupt, and downright awful. But I don’t see the connection between that and the point you’re trying to make. Could you flesh it out a little for me?

The underlying flaw in the Chinese argument is that it presumes a right to pollute. Or because the ball got rolling in the West, it’s up to the West to correct the problem.

A fundamental principle of optimization theory is that your best pick for optimization is where there’s something to optimize. That means in the United States, the greatest per capita polluter, and in China, the largest and fastest growing polluter.
 
Written By: Dave Schuler
URL: http://www.theglitteringeye.com
"A fundamental principle of optimization theory is that your best pick for optimization is where there’s something to optimize. That means in the United States, the greatest per capita polluter"

There is another fundamental principle about diminishing returns. The US has already done the relatively easy and cheap things that can be done to combat pollution. China hasn’t, which is why they have worse smog and pollution than we or the Europeans do. Another of the principles of optimization theory is constraints. US corporations and taxpayers are not going to provide unlimited resources to remove the last 0.01% of pollution from every source.
 
Written By: timactual
URL: http://
If it is abandoned, he warned, "people will just disperse and go their own ways and do their own things."
Heaven forfend!
 
Written By: Achillea
URL: http://
How can nations be fighting over pollution controls? Wasn’t last year’s "Peace" prize given on this basis? Everything should be OK now!
 
Written By: Joe R.
URL: http://

 
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